From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Fri May 07 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!HUEY.MET.FSU.EDU!bro From: bro@HUEY.MET.FSU.EDU (Bob Broedel) Newsgroups: bionet.molbio.ageing Subject: amyotrophic lateral sclerosis Message-ID: <9305080810.AA07966@huey.met.fsu.edu> Date: 8 May 93 08:10:54 GMT Sender: daemon@net.bio.net Distribution: bionet Lines: 20 ------------------------------------------------------------------ Date : Wed, 21 Apr 1993 13:38:13 CDT Sender : NEW-LIST - New List Announcements From : Bob Broedel Subject: NEW: ALS Interest Group ------------------------------------------------------------------ ALS Interest Group List c/o bro@huey.met.fsu.edu (ALS=amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, or Lou Gehrig's Disease). This list has been set up to serve the world-wide ALS community. That is, ALS patients, ALS support/discussion groups, ALS clinics, ALS researchers, etc. Others are welcome (and invited) to join. Sorry, but it is not a LISTSERV setup. For more information, please send e-mail to: bro@huey.met.fsu.edu (Bob Broedel) -------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Thu May 13 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!agate!howland.reston.ans.net!darwin.sura.net!wvnvms.wvnet.edu!marshall.wvnet.edu!newsmgr From: MAJACOBS@NDSUVM1.BITNET (Marilyn Jacobson) Newsgroups: bionet.molbio.ageing,bit.listserv.gerinet Subject: RE: reply Message-ID: Date: 12 May 93 01:29:45 GMT Sender: Geriatric Health Care Discussion Group Reply-To: Geriatric Health Care Discussion Group Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computer Network Lines: 14 Xref: biosci bionet.molbio.ageing:408 To: IN%"NEWSMGR@muvms6.wvnet.edu" "Marshall University" CC: Return-path: <@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU:owner-gerinet@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU> Return-path: MAJACOBS<@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU,@VM1.NODAK.EDU:MAJACOBS@VM1.NODAK.EDU> In-reply-to: Message of Mon, 15 Feb 1993 12:22:33 CST from To: Marshall University Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Re: my research findings. The well-being of adult children who had a parent with Alzheimer's Disease or Related Disorders, as measured on Tebb's (1992) 22 item Caregiver Well-being Scale, was positively related to the relationship with the parent with DRD, the parent's knowledge of the disease and the marital status of the adult child. These findings were statistically significant. Several trends were noted, but I need to complete multivariate analysis before I can report any additional findings. Well-being was higher for those adult children who had a positive, filial relationship with the parent, for those whose parent was aware of the diagnosis, and for those who were married. These are only tentative findings of a small (n=41), unrepresentative sample. Marilyn. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Wed May 26 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!daresbury!daresbury!news From: bafa1@central.sussex.ac.uk (Sydney Shall) Newsgroups: bionet.molbio.ageing Subject: Werner's Syndrome Patients Message-ID: <1993May27.093313.17993@gserv1.dl.ac.uk> Date: 27 May 93 09:28:08 GMT Sender: list-admin@daresbury.ac.uk Distribution: bionet Lines: 79 Original-To: ageing@uk.ac.daresbury X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] WERNER'S SYNDROME. I am working on the cell and molecular biology of a human genetic condition called Werner's Syndrome. I need assistance in this work. Basically, I am looking for patients with this condition, because they are relatively rare. Werner's Syndrome is of course, a human progeroid (premature ageing) syndrome due to an autosomal recessive mutation. Werner's Syndrome is characterised by short stature, a hoarse high-pitched voice, juvenile cataracts, premature greying of the hair, diabetes, atherosclerosis, neoplasms and marked skin changes. We are very interested in this Syndrome as a partial model of premature human ageing. It seems that the frequency of this human genetic disease is about 2 to 20 affected individuals per million population, but is particularly frequently associated with cousin marriages, which are not uncommon in certain restricted areas. We observe that this Syndrome is often presented to dermatologists. We are anxious to identify as many patients as possible in Europe. All patients identified will be (anonymously) added both to a European and to an International Registry, after both the patient and the attending Physician have given permisssion. If anyone would like further information on the diagnostic criteria for Werner's Syndrome, they should please contact me. If anyone in the ageing research field thinks they may have seen or heard of any patients with progeroid conditions, I would urge them to contact me immediately. Of course, I am aware of the progeroid cell lines held by the ATCC, but if anyone would be prepared to share cell strains or lines from additional progeroid patients, I would be deeply grateful. My address is: Professor Sydney SHALL, M.B. B.Ch. M.Sc. Ph.D. Cell and Molecular Biology Laboratory, Biology Building, University of Sussex, Brighton, East Sussex, BN1 9QG, ENGLAND. Tel: +44.273.67.83.03 Fax: +44.273.67.83.33 E-Mail: BAFA1@CENTRAL.SUSSEX.AC.UK ************************************************************************** ************************************************************************** Sydney SHALL, Laboratory of Cell and Molecular Biology, Biology Building, University of Sussex, Brighton, East Sussex BN1 9QG, ENGLAND. Telephone: +44.273.67.83.03 FAX: +44.273.67.83.33 E-Mail: Janet: BAFA1@uk.ac.sussex.central Elsewhere: BAFA1@central.sussex.ac.uk EARN/BITNET: BAFA1%sussex.central@ukacrl ******************************************************************************* ******************************************************************************* From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Wed May 26 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!daresbury!daresbury!news From: bafa1@central.sussex.ac.uk (Sydney Shall) Newsgroups: bionet.molbio.ageing Subject: Ageing in yeast Message-ID: <1993May27.141201.23608@gserv1.dl.ac.uk> Date: 27 May 93 14:01:25 GMT Sender: list-admin@daresbury.ac.uk Distribution: bionet Lines: 48 Original-To: ageing@uk.ac.daresbury X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Ageing in Yeast. Michal Jazwinski, in a very interesting talk at the 1992 Annual Meeting of the American Association for the Advancement of Science in Chigaco Il., which has been published in the American Society of Microbiology News for April, discusses his work on Ageing in Yeast. I was particularly intrigued by his description that individual yeast cells age, but that the culture as a whole does not. This means that yeast cell cultures are truly immortal; as they must be since they are unicellular organisms. Jaswinzki then draws attention to the contrast with mammalian cell cultures, in which the culture as a whole will undergo "senescence". I wonder then whether most unicellular organisms will be found to follow the yeast pattern, with metazoan organisms being more like the mammalian cell cultures. I wonder whether there is yet data available to enlighten us on this. ************************************************************************** ************************************************************************** Sydney SHALL, Laboratory of Cell and Molecular Biology, Biology Building, University of Sussex, Brighton, East Sussex BN1 9QG, ENGLAND. Telephone: +44.273.67.83.03 FAX: +44.273.67.83.33 E-Mail: Janet: BAFA1@uk.ac.sussex.central Elsewhere: BAFA1@central.sussex.ac.uk EARN/BITNET: BAFA1%sussex.central@ukacrl ******************************************************************************* ******************************************************************************* From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Thu May 27 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!CSUVAX1.MURDOCH.EDU.AU!cummins From: cummins@CSUVAX1.MURDOCH.EDU.AU (Dr Jim Cummins) Newsgroups: bionet.molbio.ageing Subject: Re: Ageing in yeast Message-ID: Date: 28 May 93 00:33:35 GMT References: <9305272035.AA28754@net.bio.net> Sender: daemon@net.bio.net Distribution: bionet Lines: 67 There's currently a lot of interest in the role of mitochondrial DNA deletions in ageing phenomena. mtDNA deletions occur much faster than in somatic DNA (in eukaryotic organisms) and accumulate preferentially in postmitotic cells such as muscle and brain. The end result is disorded oxidative phosphorylation and spin-off of free radicals. It's possible that individual yeast cells might age but the colony as a whole survives through mitosis and the selective elimination of cells with defective mitochondria? Just one idea. Jim Cummins Murdoch University Western Australia On 27 May 1993, Sydney Shall wrote: > > Ageing in Yeast. > > > Michal Jazwinski, in a very interesting talk at the 1992 Annual > Meeting of the American Association for the Advancement of Science in > Chigaco Il., which has been published in the American Society of > Microbiology News for April, discusses his work on Ageing in Yeast. > > I was particularly intrigued by his description that individual > yeast cells age, but that the culture as a whole does not. This means > that yeast cell cultures are truly immortal; as they must be since they > are unicellular organisms. Jaswinzki then draws attention to the > contrast with mammalian cell cultures, in which the culture as a whole > will undergo "senescence". I wonder then whether most unicellular > organisms will be found to follow the yeast pattern, with metazoan > organisms being more like the mammalian cell cultures. I wonder whether > there is yet data available to enlighten us on this. > ************************************************************************** > > ************************************************************************** > > > > Sydney SHALL, > Laboratory of Cell and Molecular Biology, > Biology Building, > University of Sussex, > Brighton, > East Sussex BN1 9QG, > ENGLAND. > > Telephone: +44.273.67.83.03 > > FAX: +44.273.67.83.33 > > E-Mail: > > Janet: BAFA1@uk.ac.sussex.central > > Elsewhere: BAFA1@central.sussex.ac.uk > > EARN/BITNET: BAFA1%sussex.central@ukacrl > > > ******************************************************************************* > > ******************************************************************************* > From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Thu May 27 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!agate!ames!saimiri.primate.wisc.edu!usenet.coe.montana.edu!netnews.nwnet.net!news.u.washington.edu!news.u.washington.edu!news From: mandioca@u.washington.edu Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing Subject: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: <1u5tvoINN7v7@news.u.washington.edu> Date: 28 May 93 20:51:04 GMT Organization: University of Washington Lines: 28 Xref: biosci soc.men:14670 misc.fitness:7671 bionet.molbio.ageing:412 NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.95.56.201 An excess bout of Androgens, like adrenaline, has been shown to impair the immune system. Soon after Salmon spawn, they die -- FROM INFECTIONS. This illustrates one of life`s great paradoxes: What's good for the host is even better for the parasite. "Health" (i.e. activity) must be moderated to achieve greater longevity. Caloric Restriction -- NOT SKINNINESS -- is the only known method of achieving longevity -- IN ALL LIFE FORMS. But, Caloric Restriction is also "Health" restriction. THUS: Too little, OR TOO MUCH, health causes death. "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. -- ``Morality is the herd-instinct in the individual.'' [Moralitat ist Herden-Instinkt in Einzehlen.] FRIEDRICH NIETZSCHE 18441900 -- Jenseits von Gut und Bose, 116 ``Do not do unto others as you would they should do unto you. Their tastes may not be the same.'' GEORGE BERNARD SHAW 1856P1950 Maxims for Revolutionists (by `John Tanner'): `The Golden Rule'. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Thu May 27 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!uwm.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!europa.eng.gtefsd.com!fs7.ece.cmu.edu!crabapple.srv.cs.cmu.edu!tsf From: tsf@CS.CMU.EDU (Timothy Freeman) Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: Re: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: Date: 28 May 93 21:28:13 GMT References: <1u5tvoINN7v7@news.u.washington.edu> Sender: news@cs.cmu.edu (Usenet News System) Organization: Carnegie Mellon University Lines: 50 Xref: biosci soc.men:14673 misc.fitness:7676 bionet.molbio.ageing:413 sci.life-extension:408 In-Reply-To: mandioca@u.washington.edu's message of 28 May 1993 20:51:04 GMT Originator: tsf@U.ERGO.CS.CMU.EDU Nntp-Posting-Host: u.ergo.cs.cmu.edu mandioca@u.washington.edu writes: "Health" (i.e. activity) must be moderated to achieve greater longevity. Seems like a silly definition of health to me. Caloric Restriction -- NOT SKINNINESS -- is the only known method of achieving longevity -- IN ALL LIFE FORMS. What does it mean to achieve longevity? BTW, there are a few species in which CR doesn't work. Bees, for example. But, Caloric Restriction is also "Health" restriction. I don't know whether we are still using "health" to mean "activity". Assuming that CR is done to the proper extent, restricted animals are just as active as the ad-libitum fed ones. The people on sci.life-extension who do CR say it doesn't restrict their activity. If you want people to believe you, you should at least try to give some evidence for your claims. Giving unusual meanings to common words gets in the way. Standard calorie restriction references: @book ( WALFORD86, key = "Walford86" , author = "Roy L. Walford" , title = "The 120-Year Diet" , publisher= "Simon and Schuster" , address = "New York" , year = "1986" , ) @book ( WEINDRUCH88, key = "Weindruch88" , author = "Richard Weindruch and Roy L. Walford" , title = "The Retardation of Aging and Disease by Dietary Restriction" , publisher= "Charles Thomas" , address = "Springfield, Illinois" , year = "1988" , ) -- Tim Freeman When they took the fourth amendment, I was silent because I don't deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I kept quiet because I know I'm innocent. When they took the second amendment, I said nothing because I don't own a gun. Now they've come for the first amendment, and I can't say anything at all. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Fri May 28 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!daresbury!doc.ic.ac.uk!agate!overload.lbl.gov!lll-winken.llnl.gov!fastrac.llnl.gov!usenet.ee.pdx.edu!reed!henson!netnews.nwnet.net!news.u.washington.edu!news.u.washington.edu!news From: mandioca@u.washington.edu Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: Re: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: <1u6coeINNd3c@news.u.washington.edu> Date: 29 May 93 01:03:10 GMT Organization: University of Washington Lines: 60 Xref: biosci soc.men:14676 misc.fitness:7679 bionet.molbio.ageing:414 sci.life-extension:409 NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.95.56.204 I wrote: "An excess bout of Androgens, like adrenaline, has been shown to impair the immune system. Soon after Salmon spawn, they die -- FROM INFECTIONS." Similarly, high stress will cause zits, by this same immuno suppression response. Zits are a good measure of EXCESS health (i.e. activity). I also wrote: "Health" (i.e. activity) must be moderated to achieve greater longevity. And Tim objected, writing: "Seems like a silly definition of health to me." I like it. Health IS activity. Life IS activity. If you don't like the definition then don't use it. Further objecting he writes: "Assuming that CR is done to the proper extent, restricted animals are just as active as the ad-libitum fed ones. The people on sci.life-extension who do CR say it doesn't restrict their activity." Higher levels of CR give higher longevity IF the health is "sufficient". Personally, I think dying at 19 is ok if one had a "hell of a blazing life". He continues: "Standard calorie restriction references [are . . .]" I've PLENTY of references -- thanks anyway. And he asks: "What does it mean to achieve longevity?" What do you mean: "What do I mean?"? lon7gev7i7ty n (1615) [LL longaevitas, fr. L longaevus long-lived, fr. longus long + aevum age P more at AYE] 1a: a long duration of individual life b: length of life < a study of > 2: long continuance; esp: SENIORITY -- ``Morality is the herd-instinct in the individual.'' [Moralitat ist Herden-Instinkt in Einzehlen.] FRIEDRICH NIETZSCHE 18441900 -- Jenseits von Gut und Bose, 116 ``Do not do unto others as you would they should do unto you. Their tastes may not be the same.'' GEORGE BERNARD SHAW 1856P1950 Maxims for Revolutionists (by `John Tanner'): `The Golden Rule'. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Fri May 28 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!enterpoop.mit.edu!gatech!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!news.sei.cmu.edu!fs7.ece.cmu.edu!crabapple.srv.cs.cmu.edu!tsf From: tsf@CS.CMU.EDU (Timothy Freeman) Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: Re: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: Date: 29 May 93 02:51:39 GMT References: <1u6coeINNd3c@news.u.washington.edu> Sender: news@cs.cmu.edu (Usenet News System) Organization: Carnegie Mellon University Lines: 31 Xref: biosci soc.men:14679 misc.fitness:7682 bionet.molbio.ageing:415 sci.life-extension:412 In-Reply-To: mandioca@u.washington.edu's message of 29 May 93 01:03:10 GMT Originator: tsf@U.ERGO.CS.CMU.EDU Nntp-Posting-Host: u.ergo.cs.cmu.edu mandioca@u.washington.edu wrote: "Health" (i.e. activity) must be moderated to achieve greater longevity. ... But, Caloric Restriction is also "Health" restriction. And I wrote: The people on sci.life-extension who do CR say it doesn't restrict their activity. And then mandioca@u.washington.edu wrote: Higher levels of CR give higher longevity IF the health is "sufficient". Personally, I think dying at 19 is ok if one had a "hell of a blazing life". The assertion in question is "Calorie restriction is activity restriction". Legitimate ways to continue the conversation are to say you really meant something else, to argue for the assertion, or to give up on the assertion. It looks to me like you're trying to use misdirection instead. If calorie restriction is activity restriction, then why aren't the people and animals who have their calories restricted also forced to limit their activity? I'm assuming that "activity" here means the amount you generally move your body around; if you use some obscure redefinition of "activity" at the same time you redefine "health" to mean "activity", then this conversation is a total loss. -- Tim Freeman When they took the fourth amendment, I was silent because I don't deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I kept quiet because I know I'm innocent. When they took the second amendment, I said nothing because I don't own a gun. Now they've come for the first amendment, and I can't say anything at all. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Fri May 28 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!agate!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!ogicse!netnews.nwnet.net!news.u.washington.edu!news.u.washington.edu!news From: mandioca@u.washington.edu Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: Re: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: <1u8nmkINNo62@news.u.washington.edu> Date: 29 May 93 22:22:12 GMT Organization: University of Washington Lines: 31 Xref: biosci soc.men:14709 misc.fitness:7694 bionet.molbio.ageing:416 sci.life-extension:420 NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.95.56.203 Tim wrote: ``The people on sci.life-extension who do CR [Caloric Restriction] say it doesn't restrict their activity." . . . The assertion in question is: "Caloric Restriction is activity restriction". . . . If calorie restriction is activity restriction, then why aren't the people and animals who have their calories restricted also forced to limit their activity? . . . I'm assuming that "activity" here means the amount you generally move your body around;'' I mean metabolic activity. If I could lay still all day, I'd still burn about 2,000 calories. Your: "Caloric Restriction is activity restriction" statement is ABSURD. My assertion is: (Contrary to the sci.life-extension dudes) "The benefits of CR are, in fact, actually the benefits of health (aka activity) restriction." Excessive "Health" (i.e. activity, i.e. steroids) not only results in Zits, it also causes such immuno suppression symptoms as HERPES, etc. The Androgens cause sugars and fats to be released into the blood -- THIS BENEFITS THE PARASITE. From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Sat May 29 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!digex.com!digex.net!not-for-mail From: kfl@access.digex.net (Keith F. Lynch) Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: Re: "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: <1uadjc$687@access.digex.net> Date: 30 May 93 13:42:04 GMT References: <1u8nmkINNo62@news.u.washington.edu> Organization: Express Access Public Access UNIX, Greenbelt, Maryland USA Lines: 15 Xref: biosci soc.men:14711 misc.fitness:7702 bionet.molbio.ageing:417 sci.life-extension:421 NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.net In article <1u8nmkINNo62@news.u.washington.edu> mandioca@u.washington.edu writes: > Excessive "Health" (i.e. activity, i.e. steroids) ... What are you talking about? Health isn't activity. Activity isn't steroids. > ... also causes such immuno suppression symptoms as HERPES, etc. Nobody can get herpes unless they are infected with a herpes virus. Please put brain in gear before engaging fingers. -- Keith Lynch, kfl@access.digex.com f p=2,3:2 s q=1 x "f f=3:2 q:f*f>p!'q s q=p#f" w:q p,?$x\8+1*8 From owner-ageing@net.bio.net Sat May 29 23:00:00 1993 Path: biosci!uwm.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!agate!ames!saimiri.primate.wisc.edu!usenet.coe.montana.edu!news.uoregon.edu!netnews.nwnet.net!news.u.washington.edu!news.u.washington.edu!news From: mandioca@u.washington.edu Newsgroups: soc.men,misc.fitness,bionet.molbio.ageing,sci.life-extension Subject: HEALTH-O-HOLICS + MORAL-O-HOLICS -- "Just Enough Health" causes the greatest life span. Message-ID: <1ub1vlINN6p7@news.u.washington.edu> Date: 30 May 93 19:29:57 GMT Organization: University of Washington Lines: 42 Xref: biosci soc.men:14716 misc.fitness:7704 bionet.molbio.ageing:418 sci.life-extension:428 NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.95.56.203 I wrote: "[Excess Health (activity) causes zits and] also causes such immuno suppression symptoms as HERPES, etc." Keith responded: "Nobody can get herpes unless they are infected with a herpes virus." I said "symptoms". An outbreak recurrence. Immuno suppression has been known to come from an excess bout of androgens. Keith: "What are you talking about? Health isn't activity. Activity isn't steroids." Health is a GREAT synonym for metabolic activity. TOO MUCH, or too little is INJURIOUS. If you can't appreciate the synonym, then that's ok. I just think too many people are HEALTH-O-HOLICS. Like Too many people are MORAL-O-HOLICS. Keith's sig: f p=2,3:2 s q=1 x "f f=3:2 q:f*f>p!'q s q=p#f" w:q p,?$x\8+1*8 Now this makes much more sense. Logic, without valid premisses, is worthless. -- ``Morality is the herd-instinct in the individual.'' [Moralitat ist Herden-Instinkt in Einzehlen.] FRIEDRICH NIETZSCHE 18441900 -- Jenseits von Gut und Bose, 116 ``Do not do unto others as you would they should do unto you. Their tastes may not be the same.'' GEORGE BERNARD SHAW 1856P1950 Maxims for Revolutionists (by `John Tanner'): `The Golden Rule'.