From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 00:41:00 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7B5D17A64 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:40:59 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B21717A76 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:40:57 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9ADC17A64 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:40:53 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id AAA18722 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:40:53 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEDF825.54D23CA0@hvc.rr.com> From: Bob Moss X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <1103_988647178@GANDALF> <3AED9F76.CDE10BD6@mediaone.net> <3AEDE686.D491671E@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 28 Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 23:38:46 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@hvc.rr.com Organization: Time Warner Road Runner - Liberty NY To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George Hammond wrote: > > David Jensen wrote: > snip > > > >[Hammond] > > >There are no fallicies. Don't be an idiot, I'm a graduate physicist, > > >I know what a scientific proof is and what it isn't... > > > > What's a scientific proof, I've never heard of that before. > > [Hammond] > > Definition of a Scientific Proof > (Hammond) > > A scientific proof consists of a comprehensive, > internally consistent theoretical explanation > derivable from the axiomatic "Laws of Physics", > and which, in addition, is overwhelmingly confirmed > by direct experimental evidence. Of course, anybody who knew anything about science knows you can't "PROVE" any theory. YOu can only disprove it. This demonstrates that not only you are an arrogant,delusional idiot, you are also ignorant From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 00:42:06 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4878F17A87 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:42:06 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB41517A64 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:42:04 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F10617A87 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:42:01 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id AAA18728 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:42:00 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEDF49F.6BA53CE0@yahoo.com> From: Eric Gill X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AEA0723.5EFFC08D@123jeff.com> <3AEA1617.C53B662B@mediaone.net> <3AEAE399.281C2E08@123jeff.com> <3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net> <3AEB2312.160A0557@yahoo.com> <3AEB41D1.6242A1FC@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 28 Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 23:26:19 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com Organization: Road Runner - Texas To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George Hammond wrote: > > Eric Gill wrote: > > > > George Hammond wrote: > > > > > > Jeff Thompson wrote: > > > > > > > > > > SNIP > > > > > > [Hammond] > > > Please don't eat up valuable bandwidth with Sunday School > > > level discussion. If you are academically unqualifed > > > to discuss science, please retire fom the thread. The > > > title of the thread indicates it is about "science", > > > not Sunday School or High School Logic lectures that everybody > > > has heard a bazillion times. Please allow people of actual > > > educational accomplishemnt to speak, IWO please shut up > > > because you are boring the shit out of everybody. > > > > After having been bitch-slapped by your academic superior, this > > little rant is pretty funny. > > GH: That'l be the fuckin day. ...and it was only a couple of days ago! Amazing how fast denial overtakes net.loons. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 00:43:47 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6892E17AC2 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:43:46 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5476D17ADF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:43:44 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D1B917AC2 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:43:39 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id AAA18733 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:43:39 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEDF506.64CF3095@yahoo.com> From: Eric Gill X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AEA0723.5EFFC08D@123jeff.com> <3AEA1617.C53B662B@mediaone.net> <3AEAE399.281C2E08@123jeff.com> <3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net> <3aeb5a9a_4@news01.one.net.au> <280420012028267991%pww@mac.com> <3AEB733F.A0456D35@mediaone.net> <3AEC82E2.DE1740AE@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 47 Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 23:28:03 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com Organization: Road Runner - Texas To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George Hammond wrote: > > Mr J R N Austin wrote: > > > > On Sun, 29 Apr 2001, George Hammond wrote: > > > > > Peter Walker wrote: > > > > > > > > In article <3aeb5a9a_4@news01.one.net.au>, Clayton Forno < > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Piggybacking... > > > > > > > > >"George Hammond" wrote in message > > > > >news:3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net... > > > > > > > > >> Please allow people of actual > > > > >> educational accomplishemnt to speak, IWO please shut up > > > > >> because you are boring the shit out of everybody. > > > > > > > > Wasn't this the jackass who denounced those with even greater > > > > educational accomplishment than he, because their degrees meant > > > > nothing? > > > > > > > > Just wondering how one reconciles the cognitive dissonance here. > > > > > > [Hammond] > > > The only cognitive dissonance here is between synchophantic > > > line professional academic whores like you who wouldn't know > > > God if you met him, or even a competent scientist for that > > > matter.... and a serious scientist like myself who is so > > > fed up with your hypocritical academic posturing and ritualistic > > > synchophantic nay saying he could puke. You guys couldn't find > > > your way home if you were lost in a park, much less understand > > > anything as sophisticated as Psychometry, General Relativity, and > > > God. Go correct some friggin papers or something and leave the > > > problem of 3 billion starving people to a real man like me. > > > > I've got a couple of loaves and some tinned sardines. You should be able > > to get the job done with that, eh? > > [Hammond] > I'm not working class, you are. I fight for a living. > Now why don't you go back to work and keep your mouth shut. George m'boy, that messiah complex of your is pretty funny. This aristocratic-wannabe silliness is just pathetic. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 00:53:52 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D37D217AC2 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:53:51 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E15D017A87 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:53:47 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 744B317B07 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:53:41 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id AAA18748 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 00:53:41 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEDF75D.D1133F34@yahoo.com> From: Eric Gill X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AEA0723.5EFFC08D@123jeff.com> <3AEA1617.C53B662B@mediaone.net> <3AEAE399.281C2E08@123jeff.com> <3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net> <3aeb5a9a_4@news01.one.net.au> <280420012028267991%pww@mac.com> <3AEB733F.A0456D35@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 42 Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 23:38:02 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com Organization: Road Runner - Texas To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George Hammond wrote: > > Peter Walker wrote: > > > > In article <3aeb5a9a_4@news01.one.net.au>, Clayton Forno < > > wrote: > > > > Piggybacking... > > > > >"George Hammond" wrote in message > > >news:3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net... > > > > >> Please allow people of actual > > >> educational accomplishemnt to speak, IWO please shut up > > >> because you are boring the shit out of everybody. > > > > Wasn't this the jackass who denounced those with even greater > > educational accomplishment than he, because their degrees meant > > nothing? > > > > Just wondering how one reconciles the cognitive dissonance here. > > [Hammond] > The only cognitive dissonance here is between synchophantic > line professional academic whores like you who wouldn't know > God if you met him, or even a competent scientist for that > matter.... and a serious scientist like myself who is so > fed up with your hypocritical academic posturing and ritualistic > synchophantic nay saying he could puke. You guys couldn't find > your way home if you were lost in a park, much less understand > anything as sophisticated as Psychometry, General Relativity, and > God. Go correct some friggin papers or something and leave the > problem of 3 billion starving people to a real man like me. Yeah, Peter! We all know that advanced theoretical and applied xenogeophysics aren't real science, and no real scientist would *ever* design and implement experiment packages for interplanetary probes! So quit that dead-end job and do something useful! But, George, stop mixing the viagra and rogaine. It's bad for your blood pressure. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 01:02:46 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3187E17B07 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 01:02:46 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 817AD17B88 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 01:02:44 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 329A817B07 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 01:02:41 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id BAA18757 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 01:02:40 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "Mark E. Daly" X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 20:04:49 -0400 Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 28 Message-ID: <3AEDFDA0.D80439B7@mindspring.com> References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AED9F70.5CA19ED5@mindspring.com> <3AEDE782.54140ED3@mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 1 May 2001 00:02:31 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George, Once again you have proven yourself anything but a scientist, please stop embarrassing yourself and physics. Shut up and learn to take constructive criticism, and also learn what objectivity is. May your mind rot in peace, you arrogant fool. M. Daly George Hammond wrote: > Mark E. Daly wrote: > > > > snip.... barroom rock n' roll > > [Hammond] > Hey, if you can't say something with hard science content, > don't bother using up bandwidth... we don't need any > garrulous retailing of shaggy dog stories here. > > -- > BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: > ----------------------------------------------------------- > George Hammond, M.S. Physics > Email: ghammond@mediaone.net > Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html > ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 02:56:17 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 635C817B8B for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 02:56:16 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22E9517AC6 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 02:56:14 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05F9A17B8C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 02:56:10 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id CAA18834 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 02:56:10 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright From: doldridg@istar.ca (Dave Oldridge) References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> Organization: The Human Race Message-ID: User-Agent: Xnews/4.01.30 Followup-To: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism Lines: 156 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 01:50:38 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@ca.inter.net To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George Hammond wrote in <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net>: >Mr J R N Austin wrote: >> >> On Mon, 30 Apr 2001, George Hammond wrote: >> >> > Mark E. Daly wrote: >> > >> > > PS: I find it funny that a master degree in Physics is writing about >> > > Psychology word associations. You do know that English and all >> > > languages have no mathematical bases at all. Let me take a guess, >> > > you can't get a job or accepted into any reputable school. >> > >> > [Hammond] >> > Too bad you're not intelligent enough to understand Factor Analysis, >> > or physicist enough to understand that FACTOR ANALYSIS is the >> > only known scientific method that can actually prove the existence >> > of "Gawd". >> > You have a BS in physics... apparently you have half a brain... >> > half a brain is apparently not enough. >> > Any competent physicist can see that if you take all 4,000 >> > adjectives >> > in the dictionary (in any language) that refer to human personality, >> > and administer them as a self report checklist to 20,000 people, and >> > compute the 4000x4000 correlation matrix, and find that the 13 >> > eigenvectors of that real symmetric matrix form a GEOMETRIC CUBE in >> > eigenvector space .... that that is a SIGNIFICANT and MEANINGFUL hard >> > science discovery. >> > I'm physicist enough to recognize it, and i'm not going to sit here >> > and >> > listen to some candyass no nothing tell me different. >> > Science has KNOWN about this empirical fact for 50 years, and they >> > couldn't figure out WHY a CUBE EXISTED until i came along and told >> > them. THE HUMAN BRAIN IS CUBIC for chrissakes. do you think a bunch >> > of research psychologists are going to figure that out... NO, it takes >> > a PHYSICIST to recognize it.... and I've discovered it and published >> > it in the peer reviewed academic literature (Hamond 1994). > > >> >> It looks to me like this cubic property would only apply to the part of >> the brain involved in selecting adjectives. The parts of my brain that >> regulate body temperature or control my fingers as I play the guitar >> probably have a quite different geometry, or do you know different? > >[Hammond] >Christ.... an intelligent question. Who are you, the >president of the University? > Just to bring you up to speed, Psychometry has a 100 year >history involving thousands or researchers, at least a half >dozen of them world famous (Sir Francis Galton, Sir Charles Pearson, >Sir Ronald Fischer, Sir Cyril Burt, Hans Eysenck, R.B. Cattell, >L.L. Thurstone etc. etc.) > It began with the discovery of the IQ test between 1900-35, and >then went into Personality measurements 1935-2000. These tests >use extensive "psychology questions" such as: > >Do you count your change when you buy something? >Do you examine dollar bills to see if they are counterfeit? >Do you frequently look at women's behinds? >Would rather read a book or go to a party? >Do you get pissed when people answer you "why"? >Would you rather just do things than talk about them? >etc, etc > >In 100 years, millions upon millions of these questions have >been invented by people who think they know something about >"psychology". Point is, it doesn't matter whether they do or not, >because you can "find out" what's in the question by giving >a list of them and asking the people to answer -5 to +5 say >as to how much it applies to them. > Then you take the scores from say 200 tests each having >say 50 of these questions, and you compute the 50x50 >"correlation matrix" of the questions. Then using well >known linear algebra and a computer, you compute the >eigenvalues and eigenvectors of the matrix. > To make a long story short, after 100 years of this, >and millions and bazillions of questions, they have discovered >that: > > Even though the questions may vary all > over the lot, the eigenvecors which are > found in the matrix are always the > same. > >Finally, to squelch any argument that the eigenvectors >actually depended on the questions, somebody suggested that they >go through a dictionary and pick out every adjective in the >English language that had any relation to psychology (such as >shy, bold, hidebound, aggressive, friendly, suspicious, sneaky, >daredevil, cautious, stingy, garrulous..... etc. etc). There are >about 4,000 such adjectives in most languages. > Turns out, when they factor analyzed these on thousands of >people, they got THE SAME EIGENVECTORS, regardless of what >language, what country, or how many adjectives (this has been >confirmed over thirty years of testing). > The 4-main eigenvectors turn out to be E,N,P,g (g=IQ). I was with you up to here...but when I was doing Factor Analysis of psychometric variables for a living back in 1967-68, the scientists I was doing it for concluded that intelligence (whatever we actually mean by it) was a vector in six-space not four-space). That is to say: IQ is a measure of the absolute value of a six dimension vector. This was done by taking the tests then used to measure IQ and inter-correlating them in the manner you suggest and using Jacobi rotations to pull out the eigenvectors (I ran Thurstone's data for a check on the programs). Of course what took 5.5 hours to run back then on an IBM mainframe now runs on my desktop in a a few minutes. >There is virtual universal agreement about this. In fact, >the only real question is: What causes them? > This is where Hammond came into the picture in 1994 when >he published the discovery that the 4-eigenvectors come from the >4-dimensional structure of space vis a vis the 3-Axis geometry >of the brain itself. Hammond will obviously win a Nobel Prize >for that some day. > Meanwhile, a few years later Hammond discovered that that discovery >leads trivially to a scientific proof of Gawd. > And that's who you're talking to, and who everybody is making fun of >on the Internet. Well, if you cannot explain your theory to people, they are apt to dismiss it out of hand. And frankly, I do not see how the structure (any structure) of human personality is necessarily evidence of God (and I am a believer not an atheist). Perhaps you can show me the logic here. Certainly those who tried in the past did not have Factor Analysis (or what is termed today Principle Components Analysis as a tool. Thurstone was probably the first researcher to have equipment that even rendered it possible on a small scale. What causes you to characterise your result as "cubic?" Are the eigenvectors of near-equal length? That would do it for me, I suppose, the vector being the "diagonal" of a hypercube based at the origin of its coordinate system. >> Jez. >> >> > NOW, it is only a trivial ONE STEP from there to a scientific proof >> > of >> > the existence of GAWD.... and I'm the one who has discovered it. That's nice. But what IS this step? I fail to see, as I said, how the shape of human personality leads inexorably to the conclusion that there is a God or to any really STRONG conclusions about Him. -- Dave Oldridge ICQ 1800667 ============================================================================= ================= Paradoxically, nearly all real events are highly improbable --me, 2000AD From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 03:22:25 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDD4A17B8C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 03:22:23 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB98417B8B for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 03:22:18 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 194D417B8E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 03:22:11 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id DAA18851 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 03:22:10 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Jeff Thompson X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 22:24:32 -0400 Organization: ABC DataKAP Lines: 42 Message-ID: <3AEE1E60.9C83599C@123jeff.com> References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AEA0723.5EFFC08D@123jeff.com> <3AEA1617.C53B662B@mediaone.net> <3AEAE399.281C2E08@123jeff.com> <3AEB1E89.B89A0E6E@mediaone.net> Reply-To: Remove@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk, the@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk, SPAM@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk, from@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk, jeff@SPAM123jeff.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk OK, one last shot, just to prove I can waste bandwidth as well as those who need their medication dosages raised a tad more. George, I hold a PhD in Engineering science, a BS in EE/ Mathematics plus a JD (that's a Juris Doctoris, or Doctor of Law degree, George). I suspect that I can parse _any_ mathematical thesis you care to present, and I can criticize your logic (or lack thereof) with ease. That is, with ease, once I figured out that there really were not large, missing swatches of text in your rantings, that you really were trotting this amazingly jejune foolishness in its entirety out for the edification of the troops. At first, you see, I took it for an elaborate, hugely tongue-in-cheek joke. Imagine my surprise when I found out that you actually _were_ foaming at the mouth about this stuff! Now, to cases: You can posit any argument you wish and derive any conclusion therefrom as long as you create a consistent framework within which to argue. Your creation of a different algebra than the rest of us are accustomed to using allows you to essentially 'prove' that two plus two really does equal five (for very large values of two). Heck, boy, where did you get that MS degree anyway, the University of Close Cover Before Striking? Sayonara, fool... Jeff Thompson George Hammond wrote: > SNIP > > [Hammond] > Please don't eat up valuable bandwidth with Sunday School > level discussion. If you are academically unqualifed > to discuss science, please retire fom the thread. The > title of the thread indicates it is about "science", > not Sunday School or High School Logic lectures that everybody > has heard a bazillion times. Please allow people of actual > educational accomplishemnt to speak, IWO please shut up > because you are boring the shit out of everybody. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 04:09:16 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75EB917B8A for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 04:09:15 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id F304517B91 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 04:09:13 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67D2517B96 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 04:09:07 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id EAA18919 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 04:09:06 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "Luha" X-Newsgroups: sci.physics,alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 23:10:50 -0400 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <44XF6.1342$sk1.185722@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com> <3AE849AD.34F39083@mediaone.net> <3AEBB7BE.8EF89D2@mediaone.net> <3AECB1F1.7DC0EB3A@mediaone.net> <3AED30F3.AAE433B0@mediaone.net> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 22 To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk "George Hammond" wrote in message news:3AED30F3.AAE433B0@mediaone.net... > Luha wrote: > > [Hammond] > You're a moron not worth replying to Lulu. > That was too easy, george. Choose your newsgroups better next time. I recommend that you limit your posts to alt.idiots.who.think.theyre.physicists. Ta! > > -- > BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: > ----------------------------------------------------------- > George Hammond, M.S. Physics > Email: ghammond@mediaone.net > Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html > ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 05:20:23 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAA9B17A92 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 05:20:22 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1884717AD4 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 05:20:21 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB7D317A92 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 05:20:17 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id FAA18977 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 05:20:17 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEE3B5C.25554FF0@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AED9F70.5CA19ED5@mindspring.com> <3AEDE782.54140ED3@mediaone.net> <3AEDFDA0.D80439B7@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 37 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 04:19:46 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Mark E. Daly wrote: > > George, > Once again you have proven yourself anything but a scientist, please > stop embarrassing yourself and physics. Shut up and learn to take > constructive criticism, and also learn what objectivity is. > May your mind rot in peace, you arrogant fool. > > M. Daly > > George Hammond wrote: > > > Mark E. Daly wrote: > > > > > > > snip.... barroom rock n' roll > > > > [Hammond] > > Hey, if you can't say something with hard science content, > > don't bother using up bandwidth... we don't need any > > garrulous retailing of shaggy dog stories here. [Hammond] I'm sorry, but the only appropriate response to someone as stupid, uneducated, and clearly nothing more than a mere vandal... is, once again, to tell you in an esily understood notation, to shove it up your ass. -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 06:09:47 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECB6E17B8E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 06:09:46 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4B9D17B8A for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 06:09:43 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E118817AC9 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 06:09:39 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id GAA19030 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 06:09:39 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 218 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Dave Oldridge wrote: snip > >> It looks to me like this cubic property would only apply to the part of > >> the brain involved in selecting adjectives. The parts of my brain that > >> regulate body temperature or control my fingers as I play the guitar > >> probably have a quite different geometry, or do you know different? > > > >[Hammond] > >Christ.... an intelligent question. Who are you, the > >president of the University? > > Just to bring you up to speed, Psychometry has a 100 year > >history involving thousands or researchers, at least a half > >dozen of them world famous (Sir Francis Galton, Sir Charles Pearson, > >Sir Ronald Fischer, Sir Cyril Burt, Hans Eysenck, R.B. Cattell, > >L.L. Thurstone etc. etc.) > > It began with the discovery of the IQ test between 1900-35, and > >then went into Personality measurements 1935-2000. These tests > >use extensive "psychology questions" such as: > > > >Do you count your change when you buy something? > >Do you examine dollar bills to see if they are counterfeit? > >Do you frequently look at women's behinds? > >Would rather read a book or go to a party? > >Do you get pissed when people answer you "why"? > >Would you rather just do things than talk about them? > >etc, etc > > > >In 100 years, millions upon millions of these questions have > >been invented by people who think they know something about > >"psychology". Point is, it doesn't matter whether they do or not, > >because you can "find out" what's in the question by giving > >a list of them and asking the people to answer -5 to +5 say > >as to how much it applies to them. > > Then you take the scores from say 200 tests each having > >say 50 of these questions, and you compute the 50x50 > >"correlation matrix" of the questions. Then using well > >known linear algebra and a computer, you compute the > >eigenvalues and eigenvectors of the matrix. > > To make a long story short, after 100 years of this, > >and millions and bazillions of questions, they have discovered > >that: > > > > Even though the questions may vary all > > over the lot, the eigenvecors which are > > found in the matrix are always the > > same. > > > >Finally, to squelch any argument that the eigenvectors > >actually depended on the questions, somebody suggested that they > >go through a dictionary and pick out every adjective in the > >English language that had any relation to psychology (such as > >shy, bold, hidebound, aggressive, friendly, suspicious, sneaky, > >daredevil, cautious, stingy, garrulous..... etc. etc). There are > >about 4,000 such adjectives in most languages. > > Turns out, when they factor analyzed these on thousands of > >people, they got THE SAME EIGENVECTORS, regardless of what > >language, what country, or how many adjectives (this has been > >confirmed over thirty years of testing). > > The 4-main eigenvectors turn out to be E,N,P,g (g=IQ). > > I was with you up to here...but when I was doing Factor Analysis of > psychometric variables for a living back in 1967-68, [Hammond] Thank christ you're old enough to know better.... Most of these wags are CS majors in their 20's and 30's. I'm 59, and remember running stuff on an IBM 1620. BTW, I met Hans Eysenck in Montreal in 1996, have corresponded with R.B. Cattell before he died, and know many of the big shots in Factor Analysis and Psychometry. the scientists I was > doing it for concluded that intelligence (whatever we actually mean by it) > was a vector in six-space not four-space). That is to say: IQ is a measure > of the absolute value of a six dimension vector. This was done by taking the > tests then used to measure IQ and inter-correlating them in the manner you > suggest and using Jacobi rotations to pull out the eigenvectors (I ran > Thurstone's data for a check on the programs). [Hammond] A little bit of knowledge is dangerous. there have been immense strides in Psychometry in the last 35 years. We could talk "lore n'legend" all day long... unfortunately I no longer have the time or patience to shoot the shit about details.... I can only waste time with those who show some inclination to comprehend the bottom line. > > Of course what took 5.5 hours to run back then on an IBM mainframe now runs > on my desktop in a a few minutes. > > >There is virtual universal agreement about this. In fact, > >the only real question is: What causes them? > > This is where Hammond came into the picture in 1994 when > >he published the discovery that the 4-eigenvectors come from the > >4-dimensional structure of space vis a vis the 3-Axis geometry > >of the brain itself. Hammond will obviously win a Nobel Prize > >for that some day. > > Meanwhile, a few years later Hammond discovered that that discovery > >leads trivially to a scientific proof of Gawd. > > And that's who you're talking to, and who everybody is making fun of > >on the Internet. > > Well, if you cannot explain your theory to people, they are apt to dismiss it > out of hand. And frankly, I do not see how the structure (any structure) of > human personality is necessarily evidence of God (and I am a believer not an > atheist). Perhaps you can show me the logic here. Certainly those who tried > in the past did not have Factor Analysis (or what is termed today Principle > Components Analysis as a tool. Thurstone was probably the first researcher > to have equipment that even rendered it possible on a small scale. [Hammond] as for the first point... no, I wouldn't lift a finger or waste my breath explaining anything to someone who is disinterested, unqualified, or not motivated.... there's no percentage in it.... You have to remember after all, that a knowledge of what God is.. or that there even IS A GAWD, is only for the privy few. Scientists and other technicians don't really have to know about it. Besides, I'm not here to entertain people, and I'm not in the charitable education business. Scientists can buy my book when it comes out. > > What causes you to characterise your result as "cubic?" Are the eigenvectors > of near-equal length? That would do it for me, I suppose, the vector being > the "diagonal" of a hypercube based at the origin of its coordinate system. [Hammond] Hey... another small glimmer of light.. a correlation coefficient is the cosine of the angle between two eigenvectors. At the 2nd order, you get a 13x13 correlation matrix. If you take the arc-cosine of all those correlation coefficients, you get all the angles between the 13-symmetry axes of a common CUBE. As you may know, a common cube has 13 symmetry axes 3 normals 4 diagonals 6 face diagonals -- 13 Total The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 in the peer reviewed literature). > > >> Jez. > >> > >> > NOW, it is only a trivial ONE STEP from there to a scientific proof > >> > of > >> > the existence of GAWD.... and I'm the one who has discovered it. > > That's nice. But what IS this step? I fail to see, as I said, how the shape > of human personality leads inexorably to the conclusion that there is a God > or to any really STRONG conclusions about Him. [Hammond] OK, since you asked I'll tell you... even though it's a waste of breath because it's ALREADY EXPLAINED ON MY WEBSITE, and obviously you're too lazy and disinterested to read that. Anyway, having discovered that all of Psychology results in a 4x4 matrix, it is discovered that this matrix has a higher order factor which is caused by the SECULAR TREND in brain growth. Since the 4x4 is "axiomatically" a 4x4 since it is caused by the 4x4 spacetime metric, this means automatically that there is only ONE higher order factor (by Thurstone's rule).... therefore we have found the "end of Psychology" in the single higher order factor, AND we know it is caused by the SECULAR TREND in brain growth. Turns out that is sufficient for anyone qualified in the perequsite subjects to identify it as "Gawd". Beyond that of course, since the spacetime metric causes the psychometry metric, and the curvature (higher order factor) of the spactime metric is Gravity.... this means Gravity is the physical cause of Gawd.... the frosting on the cake. if you've got half a brain, surely you must realize you are hardly qualified to dispute any of this... only qualified to inquire about it. Frankly it's a miracle you can do that. In a year on the Internet I have only found one or two people smart enough to vaguly grasp the scientific structure of the discovery... which is quite elementary in itself. the central roadblock seems to be the fact that very few people indeed have any real native intuition about what "Gawd" actually might be. ---------------- > > -- > Dave Oldridge > ICQ 1800667 > ============================================================================= > ================= > Paradoxically, nearly all real events are highly improbable > --me, 2000AD > > -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 10:31:34 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4BF517BA6 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 10:31:33 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7CA017BA1 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 10:31:30 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54EBF17B8E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 10:31:25 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id KAA22263 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 10:31:24 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "Eros" X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <%DMG6.1590$VM5.53034@ozemail.com.au> <3AEBB414.4A22F998@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Lines: 26 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Organization: OzEmail Ltd, Australia Distribution: world Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 19:29:35 +1000 To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk "George Hammond" wrote in message news:3AEBB414.4A22F998@mediaone.net... > Eros wrote: > > > -- > > EROS > > [Hammond] > EROS..... that's SORE backwards isn't it? Yep, but it also stands for Evolution Rules Out Superstition. -- EROS. "Will you speak falsely for God, and speak deceitfully for him?" Job 13:7 "Faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1 "Believers are justified in all things." Acts 13:39 From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 13:53:48 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA64F17A6E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:46 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D01DA17A9E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:44 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 822B717A6E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:41 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id NAA25249 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:40 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "Mark E. Daly" X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 08:55:37 -0400 Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 46 Message-ID: <3AEEB249.BD400F43@mindspring.com> References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AED9F70.5CA19ED5@mindspring.com> <3AEDE782.54140ED3@mediaone.net> <3AEDFDA0.D80439B7@mindspring.com> <3AEE3B5C.25554FF0@mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 1 May 2001 12:53:19 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk George, An response worthy of your intellect and objectivity, Do you even know how produce an intellectual response, rather than an abusive one? May your mind rot in peace, fundy. M. Daly George Hammond wrote: > Mark E. Daly wrote: > > > > George, > > Once again you have proven yourself anything but a scientist, please > > stop embarrassing yourself and physics. Shut up and learn to take > > constructive criticism, and also learn what objectivity is. > > May your mind rot in peace, you arrogant fool. > > > > M. Daly > > > > George Hammond wrote: > > > > > Mark E. Daly wrote: > > > > > > > > > > snip.... barroom rock n' roll > > > > > > [Hammond] > > > Hey, if you can't say something with hard science content, > > > don't bother using up bandwidth... we don't need any > > > garrulous retailing of shaggy dog stories here. > > [Hammond] > I'm sorry, but the only appropriate response to > someone as stupid, uneducated, and clearly nothing > more than a mere vandal... is, once again, to tell > you in an esily understood notation, > to shove it up your ass. > > -- > BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: > ----------------------------------------------------------- > George Hammond, M.S. Physics > Email: ghammond@mediaone.net > Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html > ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:52:41 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FF8D17A9C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:40 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1EE717A7F for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:37 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA04617A6E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:34 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id PAA18025 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:34 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: drack@grat.tuwien.ac.at (Manfred Drack) X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: enthalpy of combustion (formation) Date: 1 May 2001 15:52:33 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 7 Message-ID: <3AEECD3C.18110A2B@grat.tuwien.ac.at> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84EC617A6E for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:31 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mailhost1.rdg.ac.uk (sumh1.rdg.ac.uk [134.225.16.4]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C757917A7F for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:27 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from stpc10 ([134.225.89.10] helo=grat.tuwien.ac.at) by mailhost1.rdg.ac.uk with esmtp (University of Reading Email Service) id {14ubVj-0005qS-00} for biophys@net.bio.net; Tue, 01 May 2001 15:52:19 +0100 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en X-To: biophys@net.bio.net To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Does anybody know about the enthalpy of combustion (formation) of KERATIN, CHITIN and SILK. I know that all of them are mixtures of different amounts of monomers. But I just need approximate values. Manfred Drack --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:53:11 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BBE217AC9 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:53:09 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E57F17ADE for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:53:01 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A9C917A9C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:44 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id PAA18031 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:52:43 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Gromit X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Message-ID: <1103_988728794@GANDALF> References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.0; Windows NT 5.0) Opera 5.02 [en] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Lines: 17 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 14:53:14 GMT To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > Dave Oldridge wrote: snip > The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > in the peer reviewed literature). From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:57:53 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DA3717BB5 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:57:51 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60F0417BAC for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:57:42 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D104017AC9 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:56:36 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id PAA18037 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 15:56:36 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "Tom" X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 10:56:32 -0400 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <3ae7e476_2@news01.one.net.au> <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AED9F70.5CA19ED5@mindspring.com> <3AEDE782.54140ED3@mediaone.net> <3AEDFDA0.D80439B7@mindspring.com> <3AEE3B5C.25554FF0@mediaone.net> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 10 To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk > [Hammond] > I'm sorry, but the only appropriate response to > someone as stupid, uneducated, and clearly nothing > more than a mere vandal... is, once again, to tell > you in an esily understood notation, > to shove it up your ass. Tom: How Christian of you George, and how predictable. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 16:39:30 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 399DB17B69 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:39:29 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14D7A17A93 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:39:27 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D30BA17B69 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:39:23 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA18986 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:39:23 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Fred Stone X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 11:40:38 -0400 Organization: Freddy Bear's Nanobrewery Message-ID: References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> User-Agent: KNode/0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 32 To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Gromit wrote: > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond > wrote: >> Dave Oldridge wrote: > > snip > >> The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a >> perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. >> Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't >> an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. Its the simple properties of eigenvectors. EV's are orthogonal ("right angles") and by simple scaling could be made to be "equal" in magnitude hence "cubic" in however many dimensions. > >> (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 >> in the peer reviewed literature). > > > -- Fred Stone aa # 1369 Linux and Liking It! s/g.com/k.net/ > email From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 16:49:30 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FD1E17B6C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:28 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 076A717BAE for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:19 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5096A17A8D for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:01 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA19127 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:00 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Unsubscribe Date: 1 May 2001 16:48:58 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 5 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85B6717A8D for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:48:55 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from hotmail.com (f251.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.76]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BD7117B23 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:48:30 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 1 May 2001 08:48:28 -0700 X-Received: from 24.178.241.156 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 01 May 2001 15:48:28 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.178.241.156] X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 May 2001 15:48:28.0653 (UTC) FILETIME=[2A6311D0:01C0D256] To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 16:49:40 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE97717B73 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:37 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8B3B17B23 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:26 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6581217B6C for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:04 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA19133 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:03 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Unsubscribe Date: 1 May 2001 16:49:02 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 5 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C73F617B6C for ; 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Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:43 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0766F17A9A for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:12 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA19139 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:12 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Unsubscribe Date: 1 May 2001 16:49:09 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 5 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E421917A9A for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:06 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from hotmail.com (f269.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.144]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1006C17ADE for ; 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Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:15 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA19145 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:14 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Unsubscribe Date: 1 May 2001 16:49:13 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 5 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0311817ADE for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:08 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from hotmail.com (f154.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.154]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9188217BA6 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:48:42 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 1 May 2001 08:48:41 -0700 X-Received: from 24.178.241.156 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 01 May 2001 15:48:40 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.178.241.156] X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 May 2001 15:48:41.0191 (UTC) FILETIME=[31DC3770:01C0D256] To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 16:50:18 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0F3D17BC0 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:50:14 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C955017BB3 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:53 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7682C17BAF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:20 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA19152 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:19 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Unsubscribe Date: 1 May 2001 16:49:18 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 5 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEFFD17BAF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:49:15 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from hotmail.com (f7.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.7]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BBFD17BAD for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 16:48:45 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 1 May 2001 08:48:44 -0700 X-Received: from 24.178.241.156 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 01 May 2001 15:48:44 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.178.241.156] X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 May 2001 15:48:44.0929 (UTC) FILETIME=[34169710:01C0D256] To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 18:23:14 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C220317ABF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:23:13 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1531917ABE for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:23:12 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62D1017ABF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:23:06 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id SAA20585 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:23:05 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEEF2A7.3FBDFB85@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 35 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 17:21:40 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Gromit wrote: > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > Dave Oldridge wrote: > > snip > > > The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > > perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > > Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > > an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > > (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > > in the peer reviewed literature). [Hammond] Just told you, I've already published the supporting evidence in the peer reviewed literature... whaddau you hard of hearing or something. Online copy of paper at: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/cart.html It's not my fault you can't read. -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Tue May 1 18:26:28 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7931D17ABF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:26:27 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B862F17AC9 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:26:24 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E913817ABF for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:26:20 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id SAA20591 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:26:20 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEEF3A9.F1C8A782@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 53 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 17:25:58 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Fred Stone wrote: > > Gromit wrote: > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond > > wrote: > >> Dave Oldridge wrote: > > > > snip > > > >> The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > >> perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > >> Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > >> an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > Its the simple properties of eigenvectors. EV's are orthogonal ("right > angles") and by simple scaling could be made to be "equal" in magnitude > hence "cubic" in however many dimensions. [Hammond] Wrong again amateur guesser. You'll really have to guess harder. the 13-symmetry axes of a cube are NOT ORTHOGONAL for chrissakes. neither are the 13-eigenvectors of Psychometry.... they are rotated to "oblique simple structure" using maximum hyperplane count. You don't know what you're talking about... PCA, Rotation, Simple Structure, Hyperplane Count, etc. etc. are mathematical physics subjects light years beyond your grade school education. get outta here. > > > > >> (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > >> in the peer reviewed literature). > > > > > > > > -- > Fred Stone > aa # 1369 > Linux and Liking It! > s/g.com/k.net/ > email -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 01:54:03 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0788317A4E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:54:02 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D6CE17A5E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:54:01 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1544017A4E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:53:58 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id BAA04051 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:53:57 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Gromit X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Message-ID: <1103_988764855@GANDALF> References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> <3AEEF2A7.3FBDFB85@mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.0; Windows NT 5.0) Opera 5.02 [en] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Lines: 32 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 00:54:15 GMT To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Tue, 01 May 2001 17:21:40 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > Gromit wrote: > > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > > Dave Oldridge wrote: > > > > snip > > > > > The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > > > perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > > > Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > > > an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > > > > (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > > > in the peer reviewed literature). > > [Hammond] > Just told you, I've already published the supporting evidence > in the peer reviewed literature... whaddau you hard of hearing > or something. Online copy of paper at: > > http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/cart.html > > It's not my fault you can't read. Or that you cannot make a coherent argument in a polite fashion? Your statement was "now don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT", I am telling you that such a statement is not very scientific. Perhaps you can tell us why you believe it is not accidental? From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 01:55:07 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8176917AB9 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:55:06 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1816617B27 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:55:05 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16C6B17AB9 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:55:00 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id BAA04056 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:54:59 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Gromit X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Message-ID: <1104_988764931@GANDALF> References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> <3AEEF3A9.F1C8A782@mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.0; Windows NT 5.0) Opera 5.02 [en] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Lines: 38 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 00:55:31 GMT To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Tue, 01 May 2001 17:25:58 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > Fred Stone wrote: > > > > Gromit wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond > > > wrote: > > >> Dave Oldridge wrote: > > > > > > snip > > > > > >> The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > > >> perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > > >> Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > > >> an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > > > > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > > > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > > > Its the simple properties of eigenvectors. EV's are orthogonal ("right > > angles") and by simple scaling could be made to be "equal" in magnitude > > hence "cubic" in however many dimensions. > > [Hammond] > Wrong again amateur guesser. You'll really have to guess harder. > the 13-symmetry axes of a cube are NOT ORTHOGONAL for chrissakes. > neither are the 13-eigenvectors of Psychometry.... they are rotated > to "oblique simple structure" using maximum hyperplane count. > You don't know what you're talking about... PCA, Rotation, > Simple Structure, Hyperplane Count, etc. etc. are mathematical > physics subjects light years beyond your grade school education. > get outta here. If this is supposed to convince people that you have a serious scientific argument then I have to disappoint you. Such behavior of ad hominem is not very scientific nor very Christian. IMHO of course. From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 02:22:29 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D487417B2B for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 02:22:28 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8E3A17B2E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 02:22:26 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 081E617B2B for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 02:22:22 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id CAA04075 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 02:22:22 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Reply-To: "Daniel R Bartholomew" From: "Daniel R Bartholomew" X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism References: <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3AEB1938.15673102@mediaone.net> <3AEC62B7.38B270CF@mediaone.net> <3AEDE46D.2B67EEB5@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Lines: 48 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 19:20:14 -0600 To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk "George Hammond" wrote in message news:3AEDE46D.2B67EEB5@mediaone.net... > Mr J R N Austin wrote: > > snip <<>>> > Axiomatic Law of Physics > > Any machine designed to span N dimensional > space must have N mechanical degrees of freedom, > and, in the simplest case, those N degrees of > freedom are N orthogonal mechanical axes. > > This is why the P and D orbitals in an Atom are orthogonal. > Simply because the Schrodinger equation is solved in 3D > orthogonal space. It is why a car has 4-wheels, why a horse > has 4-legs, why a house is a cube, why an airplane has 3 > orthogonal control axes (pitch, roll, yaw) and why the human > body (particularly the brain) has 3-orthogonal structural axes. > That is the CAUSAL mechanism, explaining how the 3-orthogonal > structural dimensions of space cause the 3-orthogonal structural > dimension of the brain, and hence Psychometry. Of course the > 4th dimension, time, is trivial because the brain is not a static > geometrical structure, it is time varying (mental speed, aka IQ). <<<>>> I don't want to get caught up in this flame war, but I don't understand this law of physics. It would seem to me that if this was the reason a car had four wheels, then what about tricycles and sixteen-wheel semi-tractor trailers? If a horse has four legs because of this law, why does a spider have eight legs and an ant six? If a house is shaped like a cube because of this, what about a geodesic dome? Please clarify this. This is the ONLY part of the argument that I'm interested in at this moment. Thank you. ====================== Remove your pants to reply ====================== From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 07:04:29 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D11417A77 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:04:29 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43DD617B2B for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:04:27 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8B4D17B1E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:04:23 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id HAA04260 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:04:23 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEFA553.4964FFB6@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.agnosticism,alt.astronomy,alt.atheism,alt.athiesm,alt.sci.natural.phenomena.unusual,alt.sci.physics,alt.talk.creationism,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,sci.geo.geology,sci.physics,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3AE81A39.DCB403E7@mediaone.net> <3AE84A63.91AF7B61@ozone.ch> <3AE879D7.DE3494E1@mediaone.net> <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3AEB1938.15673102@mediaone.net> <3AEC62B7.38B270CF@mediaone.net> <3AEDE46D.2B67EEB5@mediaone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 84 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 06:03:54 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Daniel R Bartholomew wrote: > > "George Hammond" wrote in message > news:3AEDE46D.2B67EEB5@mediaone.net... > > Mr J R N Austin wrote: > > > > snip > <<>>> > > Axiomatic Law of Physics > > > > Any machine designed to span N dimensional > > space must have N mechanical degrees of freedom, > > and, in the simplest case, those N degrees of > > freedom are N orthogonal mechanical axes. > > > > This is why the P and D orbitals in an Atom are orthogonal. > > Simply because the Schrodinger equation is solved in 3D > > orthogonal space. It is why a car has 4-wheels, why a horse > > has 4-legs, why a house is a cube, why an airplane has 3 > > orthogonal control axes (pitch, roll, yaw) and why the human > > body (particularly the brain) has 3-orthogonal structural axes. > > That is the CAUSAL mechanism, explaining how the 3-orthogonal > > structural dimensions of space cause the 3-orthogonal structural > > dimension of the brain, and hence Psychometry. Of course the > > 4th dimension, time, is trivial because the brain is not a static > > geometrical structure, it is time varying (mental speed, aka IQ). > <<<>>> > > I don't want to get caught up in this flame war, but I don't understand this > law of physics. It would seem to me that if this was the reason a car had > four wheels, then what about tricycles and sixteen-wheel semi-tractor > trailers? > > If a horse has four legs because of this law, why does a spider have eight > legs and an ant six? > > If a house is shaped like a cube because of this, what about a geodesic > dome? > > Please clarify this. This is the ONLY part of the argument that I'm > interested in at this moment. [Hammond] Dan... you can hardly expect me to spend time shooting the shit with an amateur... but let me give you an example of the kind of answeres you will get to the riddles you have posed. When I tell someone that the body plan of every life form on Earth is 3-axis orthogonal (Cartesian), some wag will usually raise his hand and say "what about a Starfish". These people are simply amateurs who we can't waste our breath talking too. Any competent zoologist knows full well that the larval stage of a Starfish is as bilaterally symmetric as we are. I simply don't have time to run a charitable tutorial educational program for amateurs who are too lazy to read my website, are disinterested to begin with, and are only here to throw rocks at the cops, drink beer, and have a good time. In short, I can't be bothered answering elementary questions to people who have not made any effort to comprehend the theory... I have to reserve my time to respond to them. The questions you have asked have been answered by me a thousand times, ... point it, it's a waste of time responding to people who can't ask a more fundamental, comprehensive, or penetrating question, and I don't want to start writing FAQ's at this point just to accomodate people who can't be of any help anyway. You can read my book when it comes out later this year... it's mentioned on my website. See also, the new thread entitled "FACTOR ANALYSIS and GOD" on sci.physics. > > Thank you. > > ====================== > Remove your pants to reply > ====================== -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 07:09:28 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A0BF17A60 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:09:28 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6711117B2B for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:09:26 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D68117A60 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:09:22 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id HAA04308 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:09:22 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f Message-ID: <3AEFA684.3D1486B5@mediaone.net> From: George Hammond X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright References: <3ae8b06a.109420557@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AE8B9E2.A73DB51B@mediaone.net> <1127_988344536@GANDALF> <3AE9B280.8406B3B2@mediaone.net> <3AEADE18.6CDCEC04@mediaone.net> <3aeafab8.259537105@nntp.we.mediaone.net> <3AEB1B0F.5D8C32D3@mediaone.net> <3AEC8193.FA637652@mediaone.net> <3AEC80E6.B2458DB@hvc.rr.com> <3AEC975E.37157E09@mediaone.net> <3AECB09B.83C68B85@mindspring.com> <3AED2DAD.810FE326@mediaone.net> <3AEDEF7F.7E7B31E5@mediaone.net> <3AEE46F7.12E64920@mediaone.net> <1103_988728794@GANDALF> <3AEEF2A7.3FBDFB85@mediaone.net> <1103_988764855@GANDALF> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 48 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 06:08:59 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net Organization: Road Runner To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Gromit wrote: > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 17:21:40 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > Gromit wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > > > Dave Oldridge wrote: > > > > > > snip > > > > > > > The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > > > > perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > > > > Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > > > > an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > > > > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > > > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > > > > > > (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > > > > in the peer reviewed literature). > > > > [Hammond] > > Just told you, I've already published the supporting evidence > > in the peer reviewed literature... whaddau you hard of hearing > > or something. Online copy of paper at: > > > > http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/cart.html > > > > It's not my fault you can't read. > > Or that you cannot make a coherent argument in a polite fashion? Your statement > was "now don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT", I am telling you that such a statement > is not very scientific. Perhaps you can tell us why you believe it is not accidental? [Hammond] The result is significant at the p=.001 level. If you don't know what that means, then you're not qualified to ask the question. -- BE SURE TO VISIT MY WEBSITE, BELOW: ----------------------------------------------------------- George Hammond, M.S. Physics Email: ghammond@mediaone.net Website: http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 08:03:42 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2904417B33 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:42 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71A5017A77 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:40 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B845217B34 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:35 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id IAA05043 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:35 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: fp@bio.auc.dk (Peter Fojan) X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: unsubscribe Date: 2 May 2001 08:03:33 +0100 Organization: Aalborg University Lines: 3 Message-ID: <3AEFB1F7.2080306@bio.auc.dk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B6D017B34 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:32 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mailhost.bio.auc.dk (mailhost.bio.auc.dk [130.225.198.2]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2682917B32 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:03:28 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from bio.auc.dk (fppc.bio.auc.dk [130.225.198.106]) by mailhost.bio.auc.dk (SGI-SGI-8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA35213 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 08:44:51 +0200 (CEST) X-User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; m18) Gecko/20010131 Netscape6/6.01 X-Accept-Language: en X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Would you please unsubscribe me from the newsgroup --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 09:33:11 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD68E17AB5 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:10 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 441D117B38 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:09 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 030F917AB5 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:05 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id JAA01250 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:05 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: eom@kjist.ac.kr (Soo Hyun Eom) X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: unsubscribe Date: 2 May 2001 09:33:04 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 3 Message-ID: <3AEFC4A0.4ADEADFE@kjist.ac.kr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=EUC-KR Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ED1617B34 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:02 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from eunhasu.kjist.ac.kr (eunhasu.kjist.ac.kr [203.237.32.200]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B87917B39 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:32:38 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from kjist.ac.kr (xtal1.kjist.ac.kr [203.237.49.73]) by eunhasu.kjist.ac.kr (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA03956 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 17:44:23 +0900 (KST) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [ko] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: ko X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk unsubscribe --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 13:15:50 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8991B17ABA for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:15:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91D9017B3D for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:15:39 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B7817ABA for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:15:08 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id NAA04482 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:15:08 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: pslb@icb.ufmg.br ("Dr. Paulo S. 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Wed, 2 May 2001 15:13:22 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB39917B4A for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:13:12 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D6B917BB4 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:12:16 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id PAA06245 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:12:15 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: rgeronimo@hotmail.com ("Rafael Geronimo") X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: Dismiss me Date: 2 May 2001 15:12:14 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 11 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 079EB17BAD for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:12:08 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from hotmail.com (f159.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.159]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D29717B05 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:11:40 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:11:39 -0700 X-Received: from 24.178.241.156 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 02 May 2001 14:11:39 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.178.241.156] X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 May 2001 14:11:39.0259 (UTC) FILETIME=[CE21A4B0:01C0D311] To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk unsubscribe me please... _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 16:01:40 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17F6817B35 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:01:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E839B17B3F for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:01:36 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9ED617B35 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:01:30 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA06967 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:01:30 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: Gromit X-Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.talk.creationism,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics,bionet.biophysics,harvard.course.physics11a.q-a,sci.bio.paleontology,talk.atheism Subject: Re: The "Science" of John Boatwright Message-ID: <1130_988815720@GANDALF> References: ( Mime-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.0; Windows NT 5.0) Opera 5.02 [en] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Lines: 44 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 15:02:00 GMT To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Wed, 02 May 2001 06:08:59 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > Gromit wrote: > > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 17:21:40 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > > Gromit wrote: > > > > > > > > On Tue, 01 May 2001 05:09:17 GMT, George Hammond wrote: > > > > > Dave Oldridge wrote: > > > > > > > > snip > > > > > > > > > The 13x13 experimental correlation matrix proves to be a > > > > > perfect CUBE when you plot out all the angles. > > > > > Now, don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT...! And if it isn't > > > > > an accident, how would you explain it being cubic? > > > > > > > > Perhaps it's an accident, perhaps not. But you cannot just claim > > > > that it is not an accident without some supporting evidence. > > > > > > > > > (BTW, I published the explanation, and discovery, in 1994 > > > > > in the peer reviewed literature). > > > > > > [Hammond] > > > Just told you, I've already published the supporting evidence > > > in the peer reviewed literature... whaddau you hard of hearing > > > or something. Online copy of paper at: > > > > > > http://people.ne.mediaone.net/ghammond/cart.html > > > > > > It's not my fault you can't read. > > > > Or that you cannot make a coherent argument in a polite fashion? Your statement > > was "now don't tell me that's an ACCIDENT", I am telling you that such a statement > > is not very scientific. Perhaps you can tell us why you believe it is not accidental? > > > [Hammond] > The result is significant at the p=.001 level. If you don't > know what that means, then you're not qualified to ask the > question. More ad hominems my dear 'scientist' friend? Could you explain how you reached these conclusions? From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 16:24:01 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3674F17B43 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:24:01 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2F6F17B4E for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:23:58 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 352A517B4D for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:23:53 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA07262 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:23:52 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: bc@BUPHY.bu.edu (Bernard Chasan) X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics Subject: (NONE) Date: 2 May 2001 16:23:51 +0100 Organization: BIOSCI/MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 10 Message-ID: <200105021523.LAA10861548@buphy.bu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Complaints-To: news@net.bio.net X-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9AA717B35 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:23:49 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from buphy.bu.edu (BUPHY.BU.EDU [128.197.41.42]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B473C17B4D for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:23:41 +0100 (BST) X-Received: from [128.197.40.119] (BCMAC.BU.EDU [128.197.40.119]) by buphy.bu.edu ((8.9.3.buoit.v1.0)/8.9.3/(BU-S-10/28/1999-v1.0pre2)) with SMTP id LAA10861548 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 11:23:39 -0400 (EDT) X-To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk unsubscribe Professor Bernard Chasan Physics Department, Boston University 590 Commonwealth Avenue Boston MA 02215 (617) 353-2608 --- From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 21:39:02 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BB7417AA5 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:39:02 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id AABF717AC7 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:39:00 +0100 (BST) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D48017AA5 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:38:57 +0100 (BST) Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id VAA20337 for biophys-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:38:56 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: "John Philo" X-Newsgroups: bionet.biophysics References: <7msniv9297.fsf@jasmin.iwr.uni-heidelberg.de> Subject: Re: Diffusion of GDH Lines: 44 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 20:38:52 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net X-Received-Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 13:37:23 PDT (newsmaster1.prod.itd.earthlink.net) To: biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk I'd be very surprised if you could find any experimental data for this. I think you could safely assume the hydrodynamic radius of GDH will be fairly constant, so if you can get the diffusion coefficient at normal temperatures and aqueous conditions (or you could calculate that from the mass and a sedimentation coefficient), you could then correct that value to your conditions IF you can figure out the viscosity of this solvent at those temperatures. I know that viscosity data for D20 at 0-100 C is hard to come by, let alone for deuterated methanol or mixtures. I think your best hope would be that one of the people who study enzyme kinetics at low temperatures might have figured out these viscosities, since obviously the viscosity also strongly affects the rates of second order reactions. John Philo Alliance Protein Laboratories "Torsten Becker" wrote in message news:7msniv9297.fsf@jasmin.iwr.uni-heidelberg.de... > Hi, > i would need to know the diffusion constant of Glutamate > Dehydrogenase in a 70% v/v Methanol/Water (CD3OD/D2O) solvent > for the range of 80-310 Kelvin. > Does anybody know, where to look for such things? > > Thank you very much! > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > Torsten Becker Biocomputing Group > IWR, Universitaet Heidelberg > Im Neuenheimer Feld 368, D-69120 Heidelberg, Germany. > Tel: +49 6221 54 8808 > torsten.becker@iwr.uni-heidelberg.de > From owner-biophys@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed May 2 21:53:42 2001 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 557A317B47 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:53:41 +0100 (BST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.hgmp.mrc.a