Headwaters Forest Video Available

Don Staples dstaples at livingston.net
Sat Oct 4 10:49:49 EST 1997

catherine yronwode wrote:
> Don Baccus wrote:

Have you heard the expression "cant see the forest for the trees"?  Both
of you are correct in your statements.  However, earlier statements were
that EF! no longer spikes, yet both of you admit that they announce
after spiking.  And are you saying that NO EF!er has spiked and gone on
about their business without telling some one?  Just a random act of
violence?  Nudds and others advocate resistance, as though this is an
occupied territory and they are the defenders of the American Way.

Earlier posts by Nudds indicated that since no overt violence was used,
no harm done.  I don't mind protests, with in the law, I don't mind
propaganda, when it is identified as a one sided opinion based on one
view.  I object to justification of illegal acts in the name of EF!, the
church, the governement, the environment, etc.  There is enough measures
in place to accomodate the differences in opinions through the courts
and political system.

Any thing that creates hazard, or danger, or a threat, in the business
of logging is terrorism, plan and simple.

You both seem to think that being "back east" (Texas, back east?) means
ignorance on the timber, practices, problems, etc., of the west coast
big timber.  One announced "scientist and forester" castigated me for
not reading the literature on the problem.  I suggest that the view at a
distant may be just as accurate as your view on the front lines, at it
were.  But my interest is in the process, not in the goal.  I defend
private property rights, the rights of the owners, the legitimate
methods of change.  The weak statments "we don't do that anymore", "the
wobblies still exist" (weren't they axxociated with the American
Communist Party back in the '30"s?), "anybody could have spiked", etc.,
indicate that the local picture you both created is shaded by your own
interests.  In effect, a subjective commentary, rather than objective.

Just a personal note.  I am from Utah.  My early education was there, I
roamed that part of the world for years.  Part of my being as a forester
is rooted in the big trees of the west.  My formal forestry education
was in the midwest.  That education included the Wobbly movement, all
the laws of the west, management of the west timbers, etc.  Of course
you can say that was all based on the Fat Cat, Big Government, Big
Business, basis of forestry as taught in "the commercial schools" of
yesteryear, and does not represent the "enlightened" education of todays
forestry "environmental" schools.  I submit that the forestry schools of
today teach the same as yesterday, perhaps less of actual science due to
the increase in requirment for touchy-feely course work required by the
more socially and politically enlightened modern administrators (Sorry,
two daughters in the University of Texas, Texas' answer to liberal
schools "back east", and the required course work is a travesty of pop
gender, political, cultural and educational pap).

You can sit there at the keyboard and assume a lot about my goals, your
goals, the goals of EF!, and the knowledge of each.  

But, the point is, I commented on the legality of Headwaters, not your
right to protest.  I commented on the crime involved in spiking and
silting (ever hear of destruction of property, treaspass, criminal
trespass, etc), I commented on the dangers of the logging milling
industry and the EF!ers ability to make it more dangerous, not your
right to disagree with the management of a corporation.

I never used ALWAYS, since always never happens.  Nudds and perhaps you
have said nothing criminal has been done, yet EF!ers were tried and
fined.  You jumped off on hunting camps as a source of metal in trees,
after I have already stated all the metal in trees is not spiking. 

I would suggest both of you should work in the logging and milling trade
for a year or two to understand the true dangers involved.  Don B. may
have, I have.  This is not a novel, it is real life, and EF!ers use
terror, sedition, political deviciveness, all the true tools of
terrorist to push their goal.  You say they have stopped terror, yet I
ask, Can you guarentee that all have stopped?

I have no problem with metal ten foot up a tree.  Could have been done
in heavy snow, raising the level of the spiker.  Or, as has been shown
in some of EF!ers own films, rope up the side of a tree and spike on the
way down.  I don't discount the presence of other metal in a tree.  I
abhore the fact that terrorists developed a tree "land mine" to enforce
their will on others. 

Get real.  Your legitimate protests may change the way the big trees are
managed, if so, it will have been done in the legal methods, not through
spiking and silting.  Stop protecting the illegal methods as being
justified.  Dont cloud the issue with "mights, possibly, could have, may
be's, probablies", anything can happen, but we are discussing the
overt/covert acts of EF!ers that endanger the industry.

But, since you are in a "warzone" any tactic is legitimate, right?  And
if the workers unions are united against the companies, where are the
union strikes to shut them down for illegal or hazardous operations?
Where is OSHA?  Where is the EPA?  Where is the highly environemtally
sensative California state administraion?  I suspect your case over
spoken, based on anecdoctal evidence.

But that is what this forum is all about, ideas and opinions, just
because they are yours or mine, doesnot mean they are correct or
incorrect, just biased.
Don Staples

My Ego Stroke:  http://www.livingston.net/dstaples/

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