literature database

wchutt at monsanto.com wchutt at monsanto.com
Mon Dec 24 07:16:33 EST 1990


I am interested in obtaining a program for managing literature citations.
This program must be compatible with SUN Microsystems computers. If anyone
is aware of such a program please contact me by E-mail.
#! rnews 377
Path: monsanto.com!wchutt
From: wchutt at monsanto.com
Newsgroups: sci.chem
Subject: data base
Message-ID: <1990Dec24.124126.3050 at monsanto.com>
Date: 24 Dec 90 12:41:26 -7
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO
Lines: 2

Does anyone know if a Sun Microsystems compatible computer program exists for 
tracking literature references and compliling a bibliographic data base?

#! rnews 1946
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:40 GMT
Subject: Re: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 919
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: melling at cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:57:12 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <F+gp#&x3 at cs.psu.edu>
Organization: Penn State Computer Science
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!psuvax1!news
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Sender: news at cs.psu.edu (Usenet)
Lines: 5
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:254 comp.sys.apollo:2105 comp.sys.hp:2003
In-Reply-To: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com's message of 18 Dec 90 22:20:09 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host: client6.cs.psu.edu


How about SpecMarks for the 68040 NeXT?  They have been shipping for a
week or two.  Is the personal workstation a reality?

-Mike
#! rnews 1965
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 1946
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:40 GMT
Subject: Re: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 919
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: melling at cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:57:12 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <F+gp#&x3 at cs.psu.edu>
Organization: Penn State Computer Science
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!psuvax1!news
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Sender: news at cs.psu.edu (Usenet)
Lines: 5
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:254 comp.sys.apollo:2105 comp.sys.hp:2003
In-Reply-To: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com's message of 18 Dec 90 22:20:09 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host: client6.cs.psu.edu


How about SpecMarks for the 68040 NeXT?  They have been shipping for a
week or two.  Is the personal workstation a reality?

-Mike
#! rnews 1965
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 2303
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: daver at ECE.ORST.EDU (Dave Rabinowitz)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 01:53:22 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:46 GMT
Subject: Re: Burned-out infrared printer
Message-ID: <1990Dec19.015322.16037 at usenet@scion.CS.ORST.EDU>
Organization: Oregon State University -- Electrical & Computer Engineering
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!bionet!uwm.edu!ogicse!orstcs!usenet!ECE.ORST.EDU!daver
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <4491 at altos86.Altos.COM>
Sender: @usenet at scion.CS.ORST.EDU
Keywords: HP infrared thermal printer, smoke, fire, warranty
Lines: 23
Nntp-Posting-Host: ece.orst.edu

In article <4491 at altos86.Altos.COM> steve at altos.com (Steve Scherf) writes:
>and print and never have to replace a ribbon or ink cartridge. Then one
>day (when it was a mere two weeks old) I turned it on, and POOF! A little
>column of smoke rose from the area of the printing head. When it attempted
>to print what I had sent to it, it just made a bunch of black streaks on the
>paper. The spot on the paper where the head had been at rest had a hole burned
>through, and the rubber platen behind it had melted. That head must have
>gotten really hot to do that. The bubbled and warped plastic on the head
>itself was testimony to that.

The head normally operates on a very low duty cycle (it's pulsed on for a very
short time and then remains off until the next column).  If a dot is left on
for more than a few seconds it will self-destruct (it gets really hot).  The
CPU runs directly off the batteries and if the battery voltage dropped low
enough to lock up the CPU while a dot was on the dot would be dead, so there
is a low-voltage detector which resets the CPU (clearing the dot outputs) 
before the voltage gets low enough to cause a problem.  In your case it sounds
like there was a short in one of the inputs to the head driver (a separate
current driver chip plus a transistor for the eighth dot - the driver chip was
designed for the 7-row non-graphics printer version) was shorted to a value
which caused it to be permanently on.  Since it didn't happen until after you
had the printer and had used it successfully it might have been caused by a
scrap of metal which somehow got into the unit.
#! rnews 1772
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: TDSTRONG%MTUS5.BITNET at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU (Tim Strong)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 16:27:05 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:48 GMT
Subject: Re: Units problem....
Message-ID: <04699C2C60001D6E at gacvx2.gac.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!shelby!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 30
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU:TDSTRONG at MTUS5.BITNET>
In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:45 CST
To: handhelds at gac.edu

On Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:45 CST

>...The above are all correct.  However, here is where things start getting
>weird:
>
>
>   UBASE:  1_C^.5   =    1_A*s             <-- 1_C^.5 == 1_C  ?!?!?!
>           1_F^.5   =    1_A*s^2/(kg*m)    <-- why no SQROOT() for kg?
>           1_V^.5   =    1_kg*m/(A*s^2)    <-- why no SQROOT() for kg?
>                                               why no SQROOT() for A?
>                                               why (s^3)^.5 == s^2 ?
>...
>
>kamido at zip.eecs.umich.edu
>--

I believe quite som time ago it was mentioned that the HP48SX cannot handle
fractional exponents in the units correctly.  It just something that wasn't
built in to the calculator.  At least I believe thats how the discussion went.

At the time I believe someone posted a work around technique.  Unfortunately,
I don't have a copy perhaps someone else does and will post it.

Any takers?

======================================================================
  ___
  :__)  _   _:  _   _        TIM STRONG <TDSTRONG at MTUS5.BITNET>
  :  \ (_: (_: (_: :         Michigan Technological University

======================================================================
#! rnews 7058
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: austern at ux5.lbl.gov (Matt Austern)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 18:13:28 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:48 GMT
Subject: Bulirsch-Stoer integration on the HP 48  (Part 1 of 2)
Message-ID: <8668 at dog.ee.lbl.gov>
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory (theoretical physics group)
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!dog.ee.lbl.gov!usenet
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: usenet at dog.ee.lbl.gov
Reply-To: austern at ux5.lbl.gov (Matt Austern)
Keywords: Bulirsch-Stoer, differential equations
Lines: 142
Summary: Documentation, description, and examples.
X-Local-Date: Tue, 18 Dec 90 10:13:28 PST

I have written a program for the hp 48 which solves systems of
differential equations using the Bulirsch-Stoer algorithm.  This
posting is a description of the program, and the next posting is the code
itself.  

SUMMARY OF THE METHOD

If you look at the code, it will immediately be apparent that this
algorithm is immensely more complicated than, say, Runge-Kutta.
Although this complexity makes a single step rather slow, the
advantage of Bulirsch-Stoer is that it is often possible to choose
extremely large step sizes while maintaining reasonable accuracy.  

The Bulirsch-Stoer algorithm is described in Numerical Recipes, by
Press, Flannery, Teukolsky, and Vettering.  (If you do any numerical
work and you don't already have a copy of that book, by the way, you
should get one.)  I'll give a brief summary, just so that this
program won't be completely a black box.

If you have a system of equations of the form y' = f(x, y), where y
and y' are in general vectors, and the initial conditions (x0, y0),
then the problem is to find y(x1) for some x1.  (Normally, we require
x1 - x0 to be small; here, we make no such requirement.)  Define H =
x1 - x0.  

We divide H into n subintervals, and then use n iterations of a
simple first-order method (specifically, the modified midpoint
method) to find y(x1).  Define this value to be y(x1, h), where 
h = H/n.

The Bulirsch-Stoer algorithm is to compute y(x1, h) for several
different values of h, and then extrapolate down to h=0.  The
extrapolation algorithm provides an estimate of its accuracy; when
this accuracy is good enough, we return the answer.  Convergence is
somewhat quicker than might be expected; it turns out that
y(x1, h) contains only even powers of h, so the extrapolation is
actually in h^2.

This algorithm can occasionally fail.  The rational function
extrapolation might encounter a pole, in which case there's nothing
to do but quit.  The program checks for this failure, so that at
least there won't be a mysterious blowup.  (This is rare, but it
happened to me once.  The solution is to use a different
extrapolation procedure in those cases.  If I get energetic, I may
implement polynomial extrapolation for the 48sx as a fallback.)  It
is also conceivable that the step size will have to be reduced so far
that x+h will be indistinguishable from x.  I have never seen this
happen (my guess is that it would only happen when you're close to
some singular point in the solution of the differential equation, or
when you have a system of equations which vary on very different
scales), but there is code to check for that too.

THE PROGRAM:

There are actually four programs here: EXTRAP, NDESTEP, DESTEP1, and
DE.  (There are also two objects that are intended for internal use.
They are named in lowercase.)

EXTRAP is the extrapolation routine.  It takes two arguments, both
lists.  Level 2 contains a list of x values, and level 1 a list of y
values.  EXTRAP returns two values: in level 2 it returns y(0), and
in level 1 an estimate of the error in that prediction.  (EXTRAP,
incidentally, is where most of the time gets spent.  I've tried to
make the code in its inner loop efficient, but I'd welcome any
suggestions for speeding it up.)

DESTEP1 solves a single first-order differential equation.  It takes
five arguments.  In order, level 5 to level 1, they are: ydot,
tolerance, stepsize, x, y.  ydot is a function: it takes x and y (on
the stack, in that order) and returns y'(x, y).  Tolerance is the
required accuracy (i.e., if Delta-y is the error, then we demand
Delta-y / y < tolerance), and stepsize, x, and y are
self-explanatory.  DESTEP1 returns the same information, to make it
convenient to take another step.  ydot and tolerance are left
unchanged on the stack; the new step size is that recommended by the
algorithm (you don't have to follow the recommendation, of course!);
and x and y are the new values.

(Note: if you are too greedy with your step size and your tolerance,
DESTEP1 might have to choose a smaller step than you asked for.  If
so, x will be incremented by the step actually used.  This is
slightly unusual, though: Bulirsch-Stoer can handle most reasonable
requests.)

NDESTEP is just the same, except that y is a vector, and ydot must
take a vectorial y as an argument and return a vectorial ydot as a
result.  (Most of the code in NDESTEP, actually, is identical to that
in DESTEP1.  Merging them would be quite easy if you want to conserve
memory.)

DE is intended for interactive use; it's essentially just a
cosmetic shell for NDESTEP and DESTEP1.  It takes and returns only
four arguments: tolerance is taken from the display format.  (In STD
format, it uses a tolerance of 0.0001.)  It chooses to call NDESTEP
or DESTEP1, depending on the type of argument given.  It returns x
and y as tagged objects; if the user provided tags then those tags
are preserved, otherwise it uses the rather unimaginative labels "x"
and "y".  Finally, NDESTEP and DESTEP1 use user flags; DE saves and
restores the old values.


EXAMPLE PROBLEM:

Solve the equation x^2 y''(x)  +  x y'(x)  +  x^2 y(x)  =  0, subject
to the initial conditions y(0) = 1, y'(0) = 0.  Specifically, find y(5).

Solution:

This is equivalent to the system
	y1'  =  - y1/x  -  y
	y'   =  y1,
with y(0) = 1, y'(0) = 0.

Put the following four entries on the stack:
\<< OBJ\-> DROP \-> x y1 y
    \<< IF x 0 == THEN y NEG ELSE y1 x / y + NEG END
        y1 2 \->ARRY
    \>>
\>>
5
0
[0 1]

Then, with the display mode set to 3 FIX, hit DE.  After 67 seconds,
I get the result that y(5) = -0.178, and y'(5) = 0.328.

In fact, the solution to this equation is a Bessel function, J0(x).
The tabulated answer is J0(5) = -0.177597, and J0'(5) = -J1(5) = 0.327579.

67 seconds is a long time, but we were able to span the entire
interval from 0 to 5 in a single step, and still get three digits of
accuracy. 


Enjoy!  There are obviously better tools than the HP 48 for serious
numerical calculations, but it's very convenient to have a quick way
of playing with a differential equation.
-- 
Matthew Austern    austern at lbl.bitnet     Proverbs for paranoids, 3: If 
(415) 644-2618     austern at ux5.lbl.gov    they can get you asking the wrong 
                   austern at lbl.gov        questions, they don't have to worry
                                          about answers.
#! rnews 13791
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: austern at ux5.lbl.gov (Matt Austern)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 18:15:24 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:48 GMT
Subject: Bulirsch-Stoer integration on the HP 48  (Part 2 of 2)
Message-ID: <8670 at dog.ee.lbl.gov>
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory (theoretical physics group)
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!ucsd!dog.ee.lbl.gov!usenet
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: usenet at dog.ee.lbl.gov
Reply-To: austern at ux5.lbl.gov (Matt Austern)
Keywords: Bulirsch-Stoer, differential equations
Lines: 326
Summary: Code for integration of differential equations.
X-Local-Date: Tue, 18 Dec 90 10:15:24 PST

The values returned by BYTES are #60761d and 3026.5.

************************* CUT BELOW THIS LINE *************************
%%HP: T(3)A(R)F(.);
DIR

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@ DE takes 4 args: ydot, step, x0, y0.  ydot is a function that computes
@  the derivative of y; it must take x and y on the stack (x in level 2, y 
@  in level 1), and return y in level 1 of the stack.  Step is the step size
@  that the user requests, and x0 and y0 are the initial conditions.
@ It returns the same four pieces of information, in the same positions
@  on the stack: the function ydot (unchanged), a recommendation for the
@  size of the next step, and the new values of x and y.  Normally, the
@  new x will be x0 + step, but occasionally it will be necessary to
@  take a smaller step than the user requested.  
@ x and y will always be returned as tagged objects.  The user may provide
@  tags; otherwise, the tags will be "x" and "y".
@
DE
\<<				
     IF -49 FC? -50 FC? AND	@ Start by getting precision from display.
     THEN 4			@ Use 4 digits as default, if in STD mode.
     ELSE 
       0 
       0 3 FOR I 
	  2 * -48 I + FS? +
       NEXT
     END 
     NEG ALOG			@ Convert 3 digits, for example, to 10^-3.
     RCLF 			@ Store flags, since program uses them.
     \-> ydot step x0 y0 tol flags
     \<<
        IF x0 TYPE 12 ==	@ Result will be displayed as a tagged 
        THEN x0 OBJ\-> SWAP	@  object.  If user has provided a tag,
        ELSE "x" x0		@  use it; otherwise, use "x" as default.
        END
        IF y0 TYPE 12 ==	@ Now do the same for y.
        THEN y0 OBJ\-> SWAP
        ELSE "y" y0
        END 
	\-> xt x yt y
        \<< ydot tol step x y
            IF y TYPE DUP 0 == SWAP 1 == OR
            THEN DESTEP1	@ Call DESTEP1 if y is a real or complex
            ELSE NDESTEP	@  number, or NDESTEP otherwise.  It is 
            END 		@  assumed that if y isn't a number it is
	    		        @  a vector; if user puts in something
				@  weird, program will bomb.
	    yt \->TAG SWAP	@ Tag the new y value.
	    xt \->TAG SWAP 	@ Tag the new x value.
	    4 ROLL DROP		@ Get rid of the tolerance that is returned.
	    flags STOF		@ Restore old flag settings.
        \>>
      \>>
   \>>				

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@
@ DESTEP1 takes 5 arguments: ydot, tolerance, stepsize, x, y.  These
@  arguments mean the same thing here as with DE; we're just adding 
@  tolerance.  This is the maximum fractional error permitted in the 
@  result; i.e., we must have (Delta y) / y  < tolerance.  (That's not
@  quite the way I write the test, though; y == 0.0 may be rare, but it has
@  been known to happen.)
DESTEP1
\<< { } { } 0 
    \-> ydot tol step x y htab ytab iter
    				@ ydot, tol, step, x, and y are the arguments,
				@  and are documented above.  htab is a table
				@  of the subintervals used, and ytab is a
				@  table of the result for each choice of
				@  number of subdivisions.
    \<< 20 CF			@ Clear flag 20 to indicate that no 
    				@  extrapolation has converged yet.
        WHILE 20 FC? iter 15 < AND @ Loop until an extrapolation converges, or
        REPEAT			   @  until we have done too many iterations.
	  divisions 'iter' INCR GET @ Find number of subdivisions for this 
	  DUP step SWAP /	    @  iterations, and then find the size h of
          IF DUP x + x ==	    @  each subdivision.  Check to make sure
          THEN			    @  that it isn't so small that x+h = h.
	    DROP2		    @  If it is, then clean up the stack and
	    "Stepsize underflow"    @  signal an error.
	    DOERR
          END 
	  DUP x y ydot EVAL * y +    @ If N is the number of subdivisions,
	  y x 4 PICK + 3 ROLL 4 ROLL @  we will now do N iterations of the
	  \-> h			     @  modified midpoint method.  Most of
          \<< 4 ROLL 1 - 	     @  this is done on the stack, but what's
	      1 SWAP FOR n	     @  going on is the recursion relation
	        DUP2 ydot EVAL h *   @  <next y> = <last y> + 2*h*y'(x, y)
		2 * 4 PICK + 4 ROLL  @  <next x>  = x + h,
		DROP 3 ROLL h +      @  where <last y> is saved from before 
		SWAP		     @  the current iteration and where y
				     @  represents y at the current iteration.
              NEXT		     @ The last iteration is a bit different:
	      DUP2 ydot EVAL h *     @  <new y> = 0.5*(y + <last y> 
	      			     @                   + h * y'(x + h, y)).
	      + SWAP DROP + .5 *     @ Store this is table of y values by
	      1 \->LIST 'ytab' STO+  @  prepending it to the list.
	      h SQ 1 \->LIST 'htab' STO+
	      			@ Store current value of h^2 the same way. 
				@ (Isn't it neat that STO+ works with lists?)
          \>>
          IF iter 1 \=/	     	@ Now do an extrapolation with our values of
          THEN 			@  h^2 and y(x+step, h^2).  We can't 
	  		        @  extrapolate with a single point, though!
	    htab 1 6 SUB 	@ Only use the most recent 6 values; adding
	    ytab 1 6 SUB 	@  older ones isn't very helpful.  (Why 6?
	    EXTRAP		@  Folklore.  You can try other values.)
            IF OVER ABS tol * < @ Is the error in this extrapolation small 
            THEN 20 SF		@  enough?  If so, set flg 20 to mark success.
            ELSE DROP		@ If not, get rid of the extrapolated y value
            END			@  on the stack, and go to another iteration.
          END
        END
        IF 20 FS?		@ Did we get convergence?  If so, choose a
        THEN			@  new step size and return.  The criterion
				@  for choosing a new step size is that we
				@  want the 6th extrapolation to converge.
				@  If it took more, then shrink the step size;
				@  if it took fewer, then expand it.  If we're
				@  at exactly 6 or 7, expand or shrink 
				@  slightly.  (Why 6?  Folklore.  Experiment
				@  with different values if you like.)
          CASE iter 6 == THEN 1.2 END
	       iter 7 == THEN .95 END 16
	       divisions iter GET / END 
	  step * 
	  SWAP x step +		@ Now put the stack in the right order 
	  SWAP tol 4 ROLLD	@  so that arguments are returned the
	  ydot 5 ROLLD		@  same way as they were given.
        ELSE 			@ If control got to here, then the step
				@  size that was requested was too large.
				@  Shrink it by a large factor and try again
				@  recursively.
	   ydot tol step 250 / x y
	   DESTEP1
        END
    \>>
\>>

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@
@ Arguments for NDESTEP are exactly the same as for DESTEP1, except that y 
@ is a vector instead of a number.  Similarly, of course, the function ydot
@ must accept arguments of x and y, with y a vector, and must return a
@ vector.  There is no error checking for correct dimensionality.
@ 
@ The meaning of tolerance is also slightly different.  This is the
@ maximum fractional error for *any* of the components of y.  This
@ could therefore introduce large inefficiencies if you're trying to
@ solve a system of equations that vary on very different length
@ scales.
@ 				
@ I'm not going to bother to comment this.  The code here is identical
@ to DESTEP1, since + and * can take vectorial arguments, except for
@ the part that does the extrapolation and checks it for convergence.
@ All the hard work is done in the function lextrap, which I did comment; if 
@ you read that, it should be completely clear what's happening in NDESTEP.
@ 
NDESTEP				
\<< { } { } 0 
    \-> ydot tol step x y htab ytab iter
    \<< 20 CF
        WHILE 20 FC? iter 15 < AND
        REPEAT
	  divisions 'iter' INCR GET 
	  DUP step SWAP /
          IF DUP x + x ==
          THEN
	    DROP2
	    "Stepsize underflow"
	    DOERR
          END 
	  DUP x y ydot EVAL * y +
	  y x 4 PICK + 3 ROLL 4 ROLL 
	  \-> h
          \<< 4 ROLL 1 - 
	      1 SWAP FOR n
	        DUP2 ydot EVAL h *
		2 * 4 PICK + 4 ROLL
		DROP 3 ROLL h +
		SWAP
              NEXT
	      DUP2 ydot EVAL h *
	      + SWAP DROP + .5 *
	      1 \->LIST 'ytab' STO+
	      h SQ 1 \->LIST 'htab' STO+
          \>>
          IF iter 1 \=/
          THEN 
	    htab 1 6 SUB ytab 1 6 SUB tol
            IF lextrap
            THEN 20 SF
            END
          END
        END
        IF 20 FS?
        THEN
          CASE iter 6 == THEN 1.2 END
	       iter 7 == THEN .95 END 16
	       divisions iter GET / END 
	  step * 
	  SWAP x step +
	  SWAP tol 4 ROLLD
	  ydot 5 ROLLD
        ELSE 
	   ydot tol step 250 / x y
	   NDESTEP
        END
    \>>
\>>

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@
@ EXTRAP takes two arguments: x, y.  Both are lists.  Returns two
@ numbers: y(0) and y_err.  y(0) is the value of y extrapolated to x=0,
@ and y_err is an estimate of the error.
@
EXTRAP				
\<< DUP DUP2 SIZE DUP 3 PICK SWAP GET
    \-> X Y C D N RES		@ C and D are temporary variables (lists),
    				@  used in a recursion relation.  N is the
				@  number of entries, and RES will be the
				@  final result.
    \<< 1 N 1 - FOR COL 	@ Loop over "columns" in a 2-d tableux.
          1 N COL - FOR I 	@ Loop over entries in the current column.
	    D I GET C I 1 + GET @ What we are doing here is computing the
	    \-> DI CI1		@  values C and D will have in the next
	    			@  column.  We only use one element of C and
				@  one of D at a time, so squirrel them away
				@  to save time.
            \<< X I GET 	@ The recursion relation is
	    	X I COL + GET / @         (x(i)/x(i+col))*D(i)*(C(i+1)-D(i))
	        DUP DI * CI1 -  @ C'(i) = ---------------------------------- 
		CI1 DI - DUP    @	   (x(i)/x(i+col)) * D(i) - C(i+1)
		CI1 * SWAP DI * @
		4 ROLL * ROT	@              C(i+1) * (C(i+1) - D(i))
				@ D'(i) = -------------------------------- .
				@	   (x(i)/x(i+col)) * D(i) - C(i+1)
				@
                IF DUP 0 ==	@ This algorithm occasionally fails; check
                THEN		@  for division by 0 which would signal that.
		  3 DROPN X Y
		  "Extrapolation failed"
		  DOERR
                END
		DUP ROT SWAP 
		/ 'C' I ROT PUT @ Store new values of C and D.
		/ 'D' I ROT PUT
            \>>
	  NEXT
	  'RES' 		@ The final result is given by
	  D N COL - GET 	@   the sum of D(N - col) for all col.
	  STO+			@ This in, in fact, only one possible choice;
	  			@  any of several sums over C or D will work.
        NEXT 
	RES D 1 GET ABS		@ The last correction to the result is our
    \>>				@  error estimate.
\>>

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@
@ divisions is a vector containing the number of subintervals to use
@  in successive iterations.  There are 15 elements here; this is the
@  maximum number of iterations that we will use.  The numbers here are
@  from Numerical Recipes, and have no theoretical basis.  Once again, they
@  are folklore; changing them will reduce or increase efficiency, but
@  won't give you wrong answers.

divisions			
[ 2 4 6 8 12 16 24 32 48 64 96 128 192 256 384 ]

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
@
@ lextrap is an internal function used by NDESTEP.  Arguments are x, y,
@ tol.  x is a list of numbers, y is a list of vectors, and tol is the
@ maximum error permitted.  Extrapolates list of vectors to x=0, and
@ returns 1 in level 1 of the stack if extrapolation has sufficiently
@ small error, 0 if not.  If the extrapolation succeeded, returns y(0)
@ in level 2, otherwise returns nothing but the 0 to signify failure.
@
lextrap				
\<< OVER DUP SIZE SWAP 
    1 GET SIZE 1 GET 0 
    \-> xl yl tol N n comp	@ xl is list of x values, yl is list of y
				@  values, each of which is a vector.
				@  N is number of elements in the lists, and
				@  n is number of elements in each y vector.
				@  comp is an iteration variable: which 
				@  component of y vector are we looking at?
    \<< 21 SF			@ No extrapolations have failed.
        WHILE 21 FS?  	        @ Quit when an extrapolation fails, or when
	      comp n < 		@   all extrapolations are done successfully.
	      AND
        REPEAT 
	      xl 'comp' INCR 	@ Look at the next component.
	      1 N FOR i 	
	         yl i GET	@ Put the current component of all the
	 	 OVER GET SWAP	@  y values on the stack,
              NEXT 		@      ...
	      DROP		@      ...
	      N \->LIST 	@  and assemble them into a list.
	      EXTRAP		@ Now do an extrapolation with this list.
	      IF OVER ABS tol * >
	      THEN 		@ If this extrapolation didn't converge, then
	        comp DROPN 	@  clean up the stack, and clear flag 21 to
	        21 CF 		@  signal failure.
	        0
	      END
        END
        IF 21 FS?		@ If we're done with this loop, and flag 21
        THEN n \->ARRY 1	@  is still set, then all extrapolations have
        END			@  succeeded.  The results are on the stack;
    \>>				@  turn them into a list.
\>>

END

************************* CUT ABOVE THIS LINE *************************
-- 
Matthew Austern    austern at lbl.bitnet     Proverbs for paranoids, 3: If 
(415) 644-2618     austern at ux5.lbl.gov    they can get you asking the wrong 
                   austern at lbl.gov        questions, they don't have to worry
                                          about answers.
#! rnews 1088
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jfa0522 at hertz.njit.edu (andrews)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 18:29:38 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:49 GMT
Subject: Equation Card Offer
Message-ID: <2007 at njitgw.njit.edu>
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!emory!gatech!rutgers!njin!njitgw!jfa0522 at hertz.njit.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: news at njitgw.njit.edu
Lines: 12



What is the offer? Is it still on? Is there a deadline date? Thanks.



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john f andrews                SYSOP           The Biomedical Engineering BBS
    24 hrs                300/1200/2400               (201) 596-5679
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
INTERNET jfa0522 at hertz.njit.edu    LabRat at faraday.njit.edu    CIS 73710,2600
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
#! rnews 782
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: crain at cpsin3.uucp (Steven Crain)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 15:33:24 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:49 GMT
Subject: Saturn Assemblers
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.153324.18551 at msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>
Organization: Michigan State University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!umich!sharkey!msuinfo!cpsin3!crain
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Distribution: comp
Sender: news at msuinfo.cl.msu.edu
Keywords: Saturn Assembler Amiga
Lines: 6

Does somebody have any of the Assemblers for the HP48sx compiled for the
Amiga?  I currently do not have a working compiler (I have DICE- but I
haven't registered it yet)  Thanks.

			Steve
			crain at buster.cps.msu.edu
#! rnews 2478
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: NELSON%VWSCYG at vmsc.oac.uci.edu (Matthew A. Nelson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 17:27:00 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:49 GMT
Subject: linear fits with errors
Message-ID: <EC03481D60001CB7 at gacvx2.gac.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!shelby!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 62
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <NELSON%VWSCYG at vmsc.oac.uci.edu>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: HANDHELDS


  Below you will find a routine for doing fits to the line Y=a+bX, and
a routine to predict a value of y0 given an x0.  I realize that these are
already built into the 48, but the routines below not only provide the
coefficients a, b, and the predicted y0, but also the standard deviations
in these values, Sa, Sb and Sy0.  Knowing these errors is often times
crucial, and I have long been amazed that linear regression routines
usually omit them.             
  The formulae used for the calculations below were gotten from
"Introduction to the Theory of Error", by Yardley Beers (Addison-
Wesley, 1962).

  The first routine takes your sigma-dat, and calculates a, Sa, b, Sb
and an estimate of the errors in the y-data, Sy (this is used in the
second routine).  It changes the display mode and displays the relevant
information, and also creates the global variables a, Sa, b, Sb and Sy.

%%HP: T(3)A(R)F(.);
\<< RCLF \-> f
  \<< 4 FIX \GSY SQ
\GSX^2 * \GSX*Y \GSX \GSY *
* 2 * - N\GS \GSX*Y SQ
* + N\GS \GSX^2 * \GSX SQ
- / \GSY^2 SWAP - N\GS
2 - / \v/ DUP 'Sy'
STO \-> sy
    \<< CLLCD N\GS N\GS
\GSX^2 * \GSX SQ - / \v/
sy * DUP 'Sb' STO
\->STR "Sb: " SWAP +
6 DISP N\GS \GSX*Y * \GSX
\GSY * - N\GS \GSX^2 * \GSX
SQ - / DUP 'b' STO
\->STR " b: " SWAP +
5 DISP \GSX^2 N\GS \GSX^2
* \GSX SQ - / \v/ sy *
DUP 'Sa' STO \->STR
"Sa: " SWAP + 4
DISP \GSX^2 \GSY * \GSX
\GSX*Y * - N\GS \GSX^2 *
\GSX SQ - / DUP 'a'
STO \->STR " a: "
SWAP + 3 DISP
"fit to: Y=a+bX" 1
DISP 7 FREEZE
    \>> f STOF
  \>>
\>>

  The second routine takes x0 from the stack and returns the predicted
y0 in level 2, and it's error, Sy0, in level 1.  The first routine must
be executed before this one, in order to calculate the required coefficients.

%%HP: T(3)A(R)F(.);
\<< \-> x
  \<< x b * a + \GSX^2
\GSX 2 * x * - N\GS x
SQ * + N\GS \GSX^2 * \GSX
SQ - / \v/ Sy *
  \>>
\>>

  Any comments may be thrown to Matt Nelson (nelson at psroot.ps.uci.edu)
#! rnews 926
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.falco at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Andrey Dolgachev)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:40:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:50 GMT
Subject: HP-28C for sale
Message-ID: <276e9cf3:1464comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.falco
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: hp-28
Lines: 8

Well, I know that everybody is interested in the new HP-48's and 28s's,
but if anybody is interested in a great calculator for a low price, how
about this:  I am selling my HP-28C for only $70 or best offer.  Since it
is a HP, it's in like-new condition, with all the original manuals and
the HP-28C/S  Insights book .  The 28C is just like the 28S, just with 2k
of RAM.  Leave me e-mail on the HP board or call me at (313)-663-6798 in
Ann Arbor, Mich.
    ---Falco  or Andrey Dolgachev
#! rnews 678
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jthornto at wunderbar.ee.ubc.ca (Johan Thornton)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 04:28:31 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:51:02 GMT
Subject: HP-28 Processor Notes
Message-ID: <1476 at fs1.ee.ubc.ca>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!van-bc!ubc-cs!fs1!wunderbar.ee.ubc.ca!jthornto
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: root at fs1.ee.ubc.ca
Lines: 6

I need the original HP-28 Processor Notes.  I think they're available on 
gmuvax.gmu.edu but that system's anonymous ftp is currently not working.

--
Johan Thornton
(but my friends call me jthornto at ee.ubc.ca)
#! rnews 894
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: shankar at hpclscu.HP.COM (Shankar Unni)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:31:34 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:50 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: how to get longer file names?
Message-ID: <1340156 at hpclscu.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Calif. Language Lab
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpda!hpcuhb!hpcllla!hpclisp!hpclscu!shankar
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec6.123154 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 10

> Please tell me about 'some locally-added software'.
> If X,GNU emacs or TeX need recompiling, I give up trying 'convertfs'.

The only ones that need re-compiling are those that do directory traversal,
*AND* have been compiled on HP-UX 6.2 or older.

If these executables are compiled on any recent HP-UX (6.5, 7.0), then they
don't need recompilation after "convertfs".
----
Shankar Unni.
#! rnews 2285
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: harry at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:40:16 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:51:03 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <101950174 at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Corvallis, OR, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!hp-pcd!hpcvlx!harry
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 36

Jim Sadler writes:
>   But why doesn't HP provide the untested code
>   as "user supported" ?

We've tried something like this in the past (the SE support tape), and
we may do something similar in the future.  Our support organization(s)
have expressed reservations about such things, stating that customers
expect support for anything and everything we ship regardless of
labeling.  While I personally feel we should provide such a package, I
can't guarantee it will happen.  We are trying to accomplish much the
same goal with the ftp-able X stuff on hpcvaaz.cv.hp.com.  

>   This is the first time that I
>   have heard why HP doesn't ship certain libraries, up till now I
>   thought someone was makeing capricious and arbitrary decisions on what
>   to not included with HP-UX.  Is the above reason why certain berkley
>   utilities and librarys are missing ?

I suspect that this is the reasoning, although I don't have first hand
knowledge in the case of Berkeley stuff.  While I personally have no
explanation for the current lack of things like bcopy(), index/rindex,
etc., I believe the situation will improve some with HP-UX 8.0.

>	2.  Please, Please don't take my or anyone else postings
>	personally.  Most of the time the reason I make critical type
>	postings is because I can't get the real information anyother
>	way and I hope it might influence someone to correct my perceived
>	problem.

I can't remember ever being offended by one of your postings.  I am more
than willing to listen to criticism and certainly try to learn from it.
I recognize that the previous poster has some legitimate complaints and
problems, but for me they tended to get lost within the unusually large
amount of flames contained in the posting. 

Harry Phinney   harry at cv.hp.com
#! rnews 1124
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rvdp at cs.vu.nl (Ronald van der Pol)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:41:27 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:51 GMT
Subject: Re: indir and #!
Message-ID: <8531 at star.cs.vu.nl>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!mcsun!hp4nl!star.cs.vu.nl!rvdp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <5713 at uafhp.uark.edu>
Sender: news at cs.vu.nl
Keywords: can I enable it?
Lines: 25

award at uafhp.uark.edu (Sven Thjostarsson) writes:


>I am trying to install indir on an HP 375.  I have gotten it to compile,
>but when I try to execute a script like:

>#!/usr/local/bin/indir some list of arguments

>My shell reports to me that the file cannot be executed.  Is there
>something I need to do to enable this or is it not supported under
>HP-UX?

	Use the following syntax for setuid shellscripts:
	
	#!/usr/local/bin/indir -u
	#?/bin/sh /usr/local/bin/setuid_shellscript
	#
	# here starts your shellscript
	#

	Other options for indir(1) are -g, -n and -b.
	(see the manual page)

--
		Ronald van der Pol  <rvdp at cs.vu.nl>
#! rnews 1167
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: ash at hpindda.cup.hp.com (Art Harkin)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 21:01:36 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:51 GMT
Subject: Re: The "getdtablesize" command
Message-ID: <4310151 at hpindda.cup.hp.com>
Organization: HP Information Networks, Cupertino, CA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpda!hpcuhb!hpindda!ash
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu>
Lines: 14

/ hpindda:comp.sys.hp / preetham at ra.src.umd.edu (Preetham Gopalaswamy) /  3:00 pm  Dec 17, 1990 /

I am trying to compile a software package that was unfortunately not written
for SysV although they claim that it is.   The computer being used is an HP800
running HPUX 3.1.   One of the problems that I am facing is finding a SysV
equivalent for the command "getdtablesize" which is used (so the SUN man
pages say) to "get the descriptor table size".   What can I use instead of
this command since it does not exist on the HPs.
Any help would be appreciated.   Thanks in advance.

							Preetham Gopalaswamy

ps: You may either post the answer or send e-mail to preetham at ra.src.umd.edu
----------
#! rnews 1437
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: ash at hpindda.cup.hp.com (Art Harkin)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 01:45:04 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:51 GMT
Subject: Re: The "getdtablesize" command
Message-ID: <4310152 at hpindda.cup.hp.com>
Organization: HP Information Networks, Cupertino, CA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpda!hpcuhb!hpindda!ash
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu>
Lines: 33


Reposted since previous posting cut off the answer...

In reply to:

> comp.sys.hp / preetham at ra.src.umd.edu  /  3:00 pm  Dec 17, 1990 /
>
>I am trying to compile a software package that was unfortunately not written
>for SysV although they claim that it is.   The computer being used is an HP800
>running HPUX 3.1.   One of the problems that I am facing is finding a SysV
>equivalent for the command "getdtablesize" which is used (so the SUN man
>pages say) to "get the descriptor table size".   What can I use instead of
>this command since it does not exist on the HPs.
>Any help would be appreciated.   Thanks in advance.
>
>							Preetham Gopalaswamy
>
>ps: You may either post the answer or send e-mail to preetham at ra.src.umd.edu
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try:

#include <sys/types.h>

#ifdef hpux
    t = FD_SETSIZE;
#else /* hpux */
    t = getdtablesize();
#endif /* hpux */


Art Harkin
Hewlett Packard
#! rnews 1205
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rvdp at cs.vu.nl (Ronald van der Pol)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:47:16 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:51 GMT
Subject: Re: The "getdtablesize" command
Message-ID: <8532 at star.cs.vu.nl>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!mcsun!hp4nl!star.cs.vu.nl!rvdp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu>
Sender: news at cs.vu.nl
Lines: 17

preetham at ra.src.umd.edu (Preetham Gopalaswamy) writes:


=I am trying to compile a software package that was unfortunately not written
=for SysV although they claim that it is.   The computer being used is an HP800
=running HPUX 3.1.   One of the problems that I am facing is finding a SysV
=equivalent for the command "getdtablesize" which is used (so the SUN man
=pages say) to "get the descriptor table size".   What can I use instead of
=this command since it does not exist on the HPs.
=Any help would be appreciated.   Thanks in advance.
	Select and its functions are BSD features. Not all SVR3 machines
	include all the select additional functions. Maybe it is in HP's
	libbsd.a?


--
		Ronald van der Pol  <rvdp at cs.vu.nl>
#! rnews 2147
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: paul at prcrs.UUCP (Paul Hite)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:14:57 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:52 GMT
Subject: Re: Some Q&A's about HP-UX 8.0 and X11R4
Message-ID: <1357 at prcrs.UUCP>
Organization: PRC Realty Systems, McLean, VA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!usc!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!lll-winken!uunet!prcrs!paul
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu> <1990Dec17.113709.8929 at and.cs.liv.ac.uk>
Lines: 29

In article <1990Dec17.113709.8929 at and.cs.liv.ac.uk>, rkl at and.cs.liv.ac.uk writes:
> 
> It's disk quotaing that is possibly HP's biggest faux pas. That is a
> desperately required feature of HP-UX, especially in an academic situation
> with 100's of undergrads, and I feel that 8.0 should be 'free' to those
> without a support contract, simply because rival manufacturer's (Sun springs
> to mind) have had disk quotaing for many years.
> 
> Richard K. Lloyd,       *** This is a MicroVAX II running VAX/VMS V5.3-1 ***
> Computer Science Dept., * JANET     : RKL at UK.AC.LIV.CS.AND                 *

This is the second time in a week that someone from the academic world has 
opined that they should get free upgrades because HP is adding features that 
other vendors have had for awhile.  

Do you guys run your own business this way?  For example, when you offered 
your first C++ course, did you offer all of your former students free C++
training?  Do you routinely do this for every course, excluding only those
courses which your university offers before any other?  

Perhaps some of your colleagues will argue that bug fixes, not new features,
should be free.  But again, do you offer to reteach, for free, anyone who 
attended a course which later is found to contain incorrect information?

If you do operate in this manner, how do fund it?  After all, like operating
systems, an education in computer science is never really complete.  

Paul Hite   PRC Realty Systems  McLean,Va   uunet!prcrs!paul    (703) 556-2243
        You can't tell which way the train went by studying its tracks.
#! rnews 1636
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: dhepner at hpcuhc.cup.hp.com (Dan Hepner)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 20:02:47 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:52 GMT
Subject: Re: Fault-tolerant HP-UX?
Message-ID: <530022 at hpcuhc.cup.hp.com>
Organization: Hewlett Packard, Cupertino
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpda!hpcuhc!dhepner
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec18.131438.4762 at aplcen.apl.jhu.edu>
Lines: 24

From: randy at aplcomm.jhuapl.edu (RANDALL SCHRICKEL (NCE) x7661)

>Saw a short blurb about the subject in Unix Today, or some magazine. Who can
>tell me anything about it? Supposedly it can be used at sites with 2 or more
>HPs, so that if one crashes the other will take over with no down time.
>Pricing, reviews, any details would be appreciated. Thanx.

HP-UX 8.0 will have an optional feature called "SwitchOver/UX",
which allows for one HP-UX machine to back up up to seven others, 
and take over in the event that one of the seven fails.

The backup machine "becomes" the failed machine in all important
matters, and reboots as the failed machine.  It takes over the disks, 
and thus uses exactly the same '/' directory.   A special Ethernet 
address is used for each machine in these "groups",  and the backup 
takes over the Ethernet address of the failed machine.  The IP address
is similarly unchanged.  Thus, accessing the takeover from a network
is indistinguishable from accessing the original machine.

Pricing, etc, should be obtained from your local HP sales office.  If
you should have trouble locating such, send email.

Dan Hepner
dhepner at cup.hp.com
#! rnews 1469
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jfk at ais.org (Jim Knight)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 05:52:41 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:59 GMT
Subject: Re: All you HP experts, please HELP me................
Message-ID: <TW&+X%#@irie.ais.org>
Organization: UMCC, Ann Arbor, MI
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!b-tech!ais.org!jfk
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <52129 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU>
Sender: jfk at ais.org
Lines: 22

In article <52129 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU> v087mxgb at ubvmsa.cc.buffalo.edu writes:
>
>My company uses an HP3000/960 for their MIS/data processing
>dept. I in Engineering run a software package on a SUN
>Sparcstation (no other choice, thats all it runs on)......
>
  An interesting combination.

>Anyway, we have a database system by ASK that requires
>"block mode" terminal emulation. 
>
  Unfortunately, block mode terminal emulators are not a dime a dozen,
  and I know of none in the public domain.  Even then it would require 
  porting to your sun.  Block mode programs make extensive use of Hp
  specific terminal functions, your only choice may be to add either 
  a terminal or a PC to your desk.

-- 
=================================================================
Come Visit M-net.  Michigan's Public Access Unix and Conferencing
                         (313) 994-5023
jfk at m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us                             jfk at ais.org
#! rnews 1946
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:40 GMT
Subject: Re: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 963
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: alien at hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (Tom von Alten)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:30:31 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:52 GMT
Subject: Re: LasetJet print driver for DeskJet?
Message-ID: <15520025 at hpdmd48.boi.hp.com>
Organization: Hewlett Packard - Boise, ID
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpcc05!hpdmd48!alien
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec18.113611.1256 at urz.unibas.ch>
Lines: 10

> Internal fonts were used and the characters were overlapping sometimes.

Yup, that sounds like what you'd get if you specify a font that isn't there.
(especially if the one you call for is proportionally spaced)

You need a memory cartridge to use softfonts with the DeskJet.
_____________
Tom von Alten           email: alien at hpdmd48.boi.hp.com
                        Hewlett-Packard Disk Mechanisms Division
                        208 323-2711____________________________
#! rnews 919
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: melling at cs.psu.edu (Michael D Mellinger)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:57:12 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <F+gp#&x3 at cs.psu.edu>
Organization: Penn State Computer Science
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!psuvax1!news
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Sender: news at cs.psu.edu (Usenet)
Lines: 5
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:254 comp.sys.apollo:2105 comp.sys.hp:2003
In-Reply-To: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com's message of 18 Dec 90 22:20:09 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host: client6.cs.psu.edu


How about SpecMarks for the 68040 NeXT?  They have been shipping for a
week or two.  Is the personal workstation a reality?

-Mike
#! rnews 1965
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com (Charles P. Mok)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 22:20:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:42 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 040 NeXT (was:Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???)
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.222547.17877 at pa.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!bloom-beacon!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!shlump.nac.dec.com!pa.dec.com!fortsc.enet.dec.com!mok
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pa.dec.com (News)
Lines: 30
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:253 comp.sys.apollo:2102 comp.sys.hp:2002


In article <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>, timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson) writes...
>I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
>workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
>SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
>from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
>in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
>comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

I guess a lot of people are interested in seeing those SPECmarks and comparing
them too, including myself.  Unfortunately HP for some reason has not been 
releasing any of those numbers despite the fact that they are a member 
supporting SPEC's unified benchmarking effort.  Interesting indeed.

If you can find any of those numbers tested, please let me know too!

Charles


>-- 
>Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
>Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
>University of Iowa                             228 ERF
>Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242


---
Charles Mok/Digital Equipment Corporation
INTERNET: mok at fortsc.enet.dec.com  UUCP: ....!decwrl!fortsc.dec.enet.com!mok
---
#! rnews 825
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: luigi at paris.Berkeley.EDU (Luigi Semenzato)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 19:36:56 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:52 GMT
Subject: coff format for 9000 series 300
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.113656 at paris.Berkeley.EDU>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!dog.ee.lbl.gov!pasteur!paris.Berkeley.EDU!luigi
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at pasteur.Berkeley.EDU
Reply-To: luigi at paris.Berkeley.EDU (Luigi Semenzato)
Lines: 10

I am looking for documentation of the object file format used by an HP
9000 series 300, in particular of the assembler directives dntt, vt,
sltnormal,
sltspecial, etc.  Does anybody have something that they can e-mail to
me?

Thanks in advance
Luigi Semenzato
luigi at ginger.berkeley.edu
...!ucbvax!luigi
#! rnews 2324
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: EYRING at cc.utah.edu
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 21:09:32 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:53 GMT
Subject: HP 700/X terminal, R3 compat, but R4 ?~r
Message-ID: <104534 at cc.utah.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!hellgate.utah.edu!fcom.cc.utah.edu!cc.utah.edu!eyring
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 44

We have an HP 700/X X window graphics terminal, its a 20 inch 256 colors
box.  We have a Sun 3/470 running 4.1 OS using Open Windows 2.0.  OW 2.0
is X11R4, but the software for the x server from HP is X11R3.  Every
since I got the fonts converted from sun format to .snf HP server format
and started working with the server full time, olwm, I have had odd results
from it.  It blows up occasionally.  First thought this was due to not
enough memory onboard the server, so we went from 1 to 2 Megs on the
700/X HP server.  That didn't solve the problem.  After continual use,
say 3 or 4 programs running interactively, and with occasional use.
The system will lock up and maybe a dissassembly window appears,
on the HP 700/X server,
    ...
    Illegal opcode at FFD6F2F0
    FFF42500:   ...
    FFF42600:   ...
    FFF42700:   ...
    FFF42800:   ...
    panic: halted
    ...

I have also looked at the HP 700/X memory statistics and seen the
Amount installed      2048 Kb     Number fragments         33
Free pool            99547 Kb     Largest fragment     197379 Kb
                     ^^^^                                ^^^^^
                     |-------------------------------------|
                                  |
                                  |= big problem here!


I can only think of 2 remaining problems left, since the mem upgrade
did not cure it.
1. X11R4 Sun client software is not compatible with HPs X11R3 server
   software.   Someone should know about this, its an easy one right?
   Could R4 calls to a R3 server make the mem manager screw up so badly?
2. The HP 700/X X window graphics terminal memory manager has a serious
   bug in it.
We ran mem diagnostics on the HP and everything passed.

Any insights or comments would be greatly appreciated.

>bob witmer
>Eyring Inc., Flight Simulation
>Salt Lake City, Utah
>eyring!rcw at snowbird.sun.com or eyring at cc.utah.edu
#! rnews 592
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bary1 at vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:54:47 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:53 GMT
Subject: HPUX 7.0 acctdisk bad uids
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.225447.1705 at vax5.cit.cornell.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!unix!Teknowledge.COM!uw-beaver!cornell!vax5.cit.cornell.edu!bary1
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: comp
Lines: 10

acctdisk seems to be producing bad uids on our 9000/835 HPUX 7.0.
I saw something in the latest SSB about accounting coming up with some bad uids
#! rnews 4600
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: wwtaroli at rodan.acs.syr.edu (Bill Taroli)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:22:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:53 GMT
Subject: DeskWriter problems
Message-ID: <1990Dec19.022209.5340 at rodan.acs.syr.edu>
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uupsi!rodan.acs.syr.edu!wwtaroli
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.sys.mac.hardware
Sender: wwtaroli at rodan.acs.syr.edu (Bill Taroli)
Lines: 104
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:2012 comp.sys.mac.hardware:3854

Well, I've been nothing but happy with my DeskWriter (2278A model) until just
recently. I've been printing some rather lengthy documents from a few different
applications. With some documents, I start getting the line

               Datacomm buffer overrun - no DTR handshaking

. I consulted the manual, which says that this points to a cable problem. I
reseated the cable on both ends tried again... with the same result. I assume
that the cable itself isn't bad since normal control signals (offline, out of
paper, etc) are making their way back to the Mac. I assume that at least the
offline indicator involves the DTR line.

Two different documents I've had this happen to so far are a 20-page Word
document with just text and one small figure, and a rather large (full page)
PICT file with the Memory Map of a Plus (I own an SE, but someone tried
printing this and got the error). I've been unable to print either of these 
from front to end with any luck. I was able to print the Word document because
I'd sectioned it out from the start... but I'm stuck with a nice PICT file that
won't print.

Any suggestions?

BTW, here's my stats...

MacEnvy           System Environment Report (2.0)
==========================================================================
Filename:         MacEnvy Report
Report Date:      Tuesday, December 18, 1990  21:24:44
==========================================================================

Item              Type/Status
----------------  --------------------------------------------------------
Machine:          Macintosh SE

Memory:           16384K  (16 megabytes)
Processor:        Motorola 68030
Coprocessor:      Not installed
PMMU Chip:        Installed (in 68030)
Sound Chip:       ASC not present
Graphics:         Standard QuickDraw (B/W)
Keyboard:         ADB Standard (U.S.)
ADB Devices:      2 devices attached
SCSI Chip:        NCR 5380 installed
Clock Chip:       New clock chip (256 bytes)
ROM Version:      256K (Version 118), rev. 1
ROM C7 Info:      $B2E362A8 (Mac SE ROM)

System:           Version 6.0.5  (409K)
Finder:           Version 6.1.5
MultiFinder*:     Version 6.1b9  (active)
Localized For:    U.S./Canada (0)
File System:      HFS (Hierarchical)
Debugger:         Installed at $0001BB60
RAM Cache:        32K, cache disabled
Current App:      "DAJHandler"
User Name:        "Bill Taroli"
Printing To:      DeskWriter (A.02.00)
AppleTalk*:       AppleTalk is not loaded.
File Server:      No remote volumes found

SCSI Devices:     0 - - - - - - 7
SCSI Drives:      1 SCSI drive @ ID# 0
Sony Drives:      1=800K, 2=800K, 3=None
Controller:       IWM chip (GCR only)
Other Drives:     None
Boot Volume:      Desktop  (43 MB)
Volume Use:       34939K used, 8271K free
Catalog Info:     703 files, 94 folders
Catalog Size:     512K + 512K extents
Boot Blocks:      Version 23
Startup App:      "MultiFinder"

Monitors:         1 screen device
Main Screen:      512 x 342 pixels
 Resolution:      72 x 72 pixels per inch
 Pixel Depth:     1 bit/pixel (monochrome)
Alt Screen:       N/A
 Resolution:      N/A
 Pixel Depth:     N/A
NuBus Cards:      Slot Manager not present

PRAM Status:      Last write valid ($A8)
Modem Port:       9600 baud, D=8, S=2, N
Printer Port:     9600 baud, D=8, S=2, N %
Boot Drive:       External (drive #2)
Default Font:     Garamond
Speaker Vol:      Current setting = 2
Mouse Setup:      Dbl-Click = 32, Scaling: On
Key Repeat:       Rate = 2, Threshold = 16
Blink Rates:      Caret = 32, Menu: 2 times
Latitude:         0! 0' 0" North
Longitude:        0! 0' 0" East
Time Zone:        0 hr, 0 min east of GMT


Any help is greatly appreciated.

Regards

-- 
*******************************************************************************
* Bill Taroli (WWTAROLI at RODAN.acs.syr.edu)    | "You can and must understand  *
* Syracuse University, Syracuse NY            | computers NOW!" -- Ted Nelson *
*******************************************************************************
#! rnews 3488
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: lindner at cs.umn.edu (Paul Lindner)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 07:48:14 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:51:04 GMT
Subject: More Generic HP Questions and Thanks
Message-ID: <1990Dec19.074814.941 at cs.umn.edu>
Organization: University of Minnesota, Minneapolis, CSci dept.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!umich!umeecs!msi.umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lindner
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 59

I really want to thank you all for helping me get up to speed administrating
my new HP workstations.  I truly would be quite in the dark without the
great tips everyone supplied me with.

So here goes.  My problems with YP was that (duh) I had to manually
add the +::0:0::: lines to /etc/passwd and /etc/group, easy oversight.
I got decent versions of finger and talk from me10.lbl.gov.  I also got
the new HP X server.  I compiled the R4 clients and libraries easily.
(The HP server is actually faster than the Xhp server... wow!, and it
now correctly does titlebar squeezing! yeah!)  This all went quite smoothly.

I did encounter a problem with the /etc/exports file.  Apparently you cannot
just put a directory that you want to export like under SunOS.  You have
to put a "file-system" name in there.  (In this case / instead of /usr/local).
This brings up another problem: Can I repartition drives?  mediainit
is weird.


So now for the questions (Yes I still haven't received a tape drive
or manual set yet, sigh....) 

1. Are the vtdaemon, rlbdaemon, nftdaemon, and rfadaemon worth running?
   Our current setup is based around Suns, i.e. the HP server is a YP
   slave to a Sun YP master.  Everyone around here uses telnet or rsh
   (er make that remsh).  Will any of HP's software break without these
   weird NS daemons?  We're planning on using Softbench and some
   strange 68000 embedded system emulator thingie that I haven't touched
   yet.  I've already disabled rwhod which is a bit of a network/compute
   hog.

2. What options can I disable from my kernel?  The machines that I have
   are 400t's with 200 meg SCSI disks and not much else.  I've already
   removed all but the SCSI disk driver.  I also got rid of the
   tape drivers, ane printer drivers.  I think I've got most of the
   unecessary junk out of the kernel.  Does anyone have any tips for
   the optimal settings for the various operating system parameters?
   This ties with problem #1, if I get rid of the stuff in #1 can I
   safely get rid of NS services in the kernel?

3. Does anyone know of an automounter for the HP that will read Sun's
   auto.master and auto.direct maps?  I realize that I could use the
   virtual home directory madness, but I would rather not.  Otherwise
   I may consider writing a little shell script that converts 
   auto.direct files into the appropriate HP maps.  (This would
   be automagically used in the YP Makefile, so I really wouldn't
   have to fiddle with it once it worked.)

4. Is there an equivilant to pstat that I'm somehow missing?

5. I'm still working on my port of PLP (my favorite lpd replacement.)
   If someone's already done this, let me know.. please!

Thanks in advance!

-- 
Paul Lindner, Univ. of MN   \ Microcomputer /  Pauls Law: You can't
IT Sun dude, & UofM ACM pres \ Workstation / fall off the floor.
lindner at boombox.micro.umn.edu \ Networks  / {...!rutgers!umn-cs!lindner}
     |   |  |  |  | | | | |||||\ Center  /||||| | | | |  |  |  |   |

#! rnews 4600
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: wwtaroli at rodan.acs.syr.edu (Bill Taroli)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:22:09 GMT
Date-Received: Thu, 20 Dec 1990 07:50:53 GMT
Subject: DeskWriter problems
Message-ID: <1990Dec19.022209.5340 at rodan.acs.syr.edu>
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uupsi!rodan.acs.syr.edu!wwtaroli
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.sys.mac.hardware
Sender: wwtaroli at rodan.acs.syr.edu (Bill Taroli)
Lines: 104
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:2012 comp.sys.mac.hardware:3854

Well, I've been nothing but happy with my DeskWriter (2278A model) until just
recently. I've been printing some rather lengthy documents from a few different
applications. With some documents, I start getting the line

               Datacomm buffer overrun - no DTR handshaking

. I consulted the manual, which says that this points to a cable problem. I
reseated the cable on both ends tried again... with the same result. I assume
that the cable itself isn't bad since normal control signals (offline, out of
paper, etc) are making their way back to the Mac. I assume that at least the
offline indicator involves the DTR line.

Two different documents I've had this happen to so far are a 20-page Word
document with just text and one small figure, and a rather large (full page)
PICT file with the Memory Map of a Plus (I own an SE, but someone tried
printing this and got the error). I've been unable to print either of these 
from front to end with any luck. I was able to print the Word document because
I'd sectioned it out from the start... but I'm stuck with a nice PICT file that
won't print.

Any suggestions?

BTW, here's my stats...

MacEnvy           System Environment Report (2.0)
==========================================================================
Filename:         MacEnvy Report
Report Date:      Tuesday, December 18, 1990  21:24:44
==========================================================================

Item              Type/Status
----------------  --------------------------------------------------------
Machine:          Macintosh SE

Memory:           16384K  (16 megabytes)
Processor:        Motorola 68030
Coprocessor:      Not installed
PMMU Chip:        Installed (in 68030)
Sound Chip:       ASC not present
Graphics:         Standard QuickDraw (B/W)
Keyboard:         ADB Standard (U.S.)
ADB Devices:      2 devices attached
SCSI Chip:        NCR 5380 installed
Clock Chip:       New clock chip (256 bytes)
ROM Version:      256K (Version 118), rev. 1
ROM C7 Info:      $B2E362A8 (Mac SE ROM)

System:           Version 6.0.5  (409K)
Finder:           Version 6.1.5
MultiFinder*:     Version 6.1b9  (active)
Localized For:    U.S./Canada (0)
File System:      HFS (Hierarchical)
Debugger:         Installed at $0001BB60
RAM Cache:        32K, cache disabled
Current App:      "DAJHandler"
User Name:        "Bill Taroli"
Printing To:      DeskWriter (A.02.00)
AppleTalk*:       AppleTalk is not loaded.
File Server:      No remote volumes found

SCSI Devices:     0 - - - - - - 7
SCSI Drives:      1 SCSI drive @ ID# 0
Sony Drives:      1=800K, 2=800K, 3=None
Controller:       IWM chip (GCR only)
Other Drives:     None
Boot Volume:      Desktop  (43 MB)
Volume Use:       34939K used, 8271K free
Catalog Info:     703 files, 94 folders
Catalog Size:     512K + 512K extents
Boot Blocks:      Version 23
Startup App:      "MultiFinder"

Monitors:         1 screen device
Main Screen:      512 x 342 pixels
 Resolution:      72 x 72 pixels per inch
 Pixel Depth:     1 bit/pixel (monochrome)
Alt Screen:       N/A
 Resolution:      N/A
 Pixel Depth:     N/A
NuBus Cards:      Slot Manager not present

PRAM Status:      Last write valid ($A8)
Modem Port:       9600 baud, D=8, S=2, N
Printer Port:     9600 baud, D=8, S=2, N %
Boot Drive:       External (drive #2)
Default Font:     Garamond
Speaker Vol:      Current setting = 2
Mouse Setup:      Dbl-Click = 32, Scaling: On
Key Repeat:       Rate = 2, Threshold = 16
Blink Rates:      Caret = 32, Menu: 2 times
Latitude:         0! 0' 0" North
Longitude:        0! 0' 0" East
Time Zone:        0 hr, 0 min east of GMT


Any help is greatly appreciated.

Regards

-- 
*******************************************************************************
* Bill Taroli (WWTAROLI at RODAN.acs.syr.edu)    | "You can and must understand  *
* Syracuse University, Syracuse NY            | computers NOW!" -- Ted Nelson *
*******************************************************************************

#! rnews 1607
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: scott at hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM (Jim Scott)
Date: Fri, 21 Dec 1990 15:00:53 GMT
Date-Received: Fri, 21 Dec 1990 15:00:53 GMT
Subject: Re: rom disk
Message-ID: <27580004 at hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett Packard St. Louis, Mo.
Path: hpuslma!scott
Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.2  87/11/24; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
References: <16894 at brahms.udel.edu>

As an addendum to Henry's comments on 'battery backed ROM disks,' Checkmate
went out of business and the company that picked up some of their line of
products decided not to support the Memorysaver card.  My Memorysaver died
a few months ago, so now I am back to trying A.E's. Ramkeeper once they
send me a new I.C. that will work with either my A.I. or S & S 4MB RAM
board.  One caveat with the Ramkeeper, too, A.E. doesn't manufacture it
anymore either, but they do still support it; my current one was purchased
used and I added the latest firmware upgrade, Rev. 1.7 (1.4 was probably
sufficient for my IIGS ROM 01 machine).

Being spoiled by having GS/OS and Appleworks GS in ROM for extremely fast
boot up and access 'forced' me to try implementing it with the Ramkeeper
once again.  My first one wouldn't handle both 256K and 1MB chip RAM cards
and that is why I originally bought the Memorysaver.  

By the way A.E. tech. support told me that the Ramkeeper wasn't selling
enough to warrant its continuation; their Vulcan hard disks are what they
are pushing for mass storage and faster file access vs. 3.5" floppies.

Jim

#! rnews 1440
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 14:42:36 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:16 GMT
Subject: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>
Organization: CAD-Research, U. of Iowa, Iowa City, Iowa
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!ns-mx!ccad.uiowa.edu!timv
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Followup-to: comp.benchmarks
Lines: 18
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:245 comp.sys.apollo:2093 comp.sys.hp:1999

I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

BTW, I would be running DOMAIN/OS, but results from either environment
would be useful.

Thanks,
--tv

-- 
Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
University of Iowa                             228 ERF
Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242
#! rnews 1440
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 14:42:36 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:16 GMT
Subject: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>
Organization: CAD-Research, U. of Iowa, Iowa City, Iowa
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!ns-mx!ccad.uiowa.edu!timv
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Followup-to: comp.benchmarks
Lines: 18
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:245 comp.sys.apollo:2093 comp.sys.hp:1999

I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

BTW, I would be running DOMAIN/OS, but results from either environment
would be useful.

Thanks,
--tv

-- 
Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
University of Iowa                             228 ERF
Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242
#! rnews 700
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.kevin at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Kevin Jessup)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 23:40:07 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:55 GMT
Subject: Re: DTE48 and Packet
Message-ID: <276d5282:1436.4comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.kevin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <1990Dec13.020335.13500 at isis.cs.du.edu> <12433 at life.ai.mit.edu>
Keywords: terminal packet radio null-modem
Lines: 3

I have successfully connected my 48SX to a HAYES modem with a null modem
cable inserted between the MODEM and the 48SX to PC serial cable.
Worked great!
#! rnews 1897
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: cloos at acsu.buffalo.edu (James H. Cloos)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:48:03 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:57 GMT
Subject: Re: HP48: Code Objects in User Language Programs
Message-ID: <52082 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU>
Organization: State University of New York @ Buffalo
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!acsu.buffalo.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <kskalb.661187537 at faui1f>
Sender: news at acsu.Buffalo.EDU
Lines: 38
Nntp-Posting-Host: lictor.acsu.buffalo.edu

In article <kskalb.661187537 at faui1f> kskalb at faui1f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Klaus Kalb) writes:
[etc.]
>Can a code object be included into a user language program ?
>If yes, how ?
[etc.]

You will have to use a function such as \->PRG posted previously by
Rick Grevelle.  (see below).  To do this, write your usrlang program
as usual, execute PRG\-> to put each element of the porgram on the
stack, put your code object on the stack, then use ROLLD & ROLL to
position the CODE where it belongs in the program (interactive stack
helps here).  If you left a marker for where the code was to be
inserted, make sure you remove it from the stack, if you didn't, make
sure you increment the #_of_elements count that PRG\-> left on level
1.  Now use \->PRG to combine the elements back into a program.

The four programs in the downloadable dir below need to be run thru
ASC\-> to use them.  Here is the DIR:

%%HP: T(3)A(R)F(.);
DIR
  \->PRG
"D9D2043C8154450B21305CEC"
  PRG\->
"D9D202BA812BF81F3040379C1B21305293"
  ALG\->
"D9D202BA812BF8194040379C1B2130C3D2"
  \->ALG
"D9D2043C81D6450B2130474F"
END

These routines do do argument checking.

-JimC
--
James H. Cloos, Jr.		Phone:  +1 716 673-1250
cloos at ACSU.Buffalo.EDU		Snail:  PersonalZipCode:  14048-0772, USA
cloos at ub.UUCP			Quote:  <>
#! rnews 2977
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.joehorn at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Joseph K. Horn)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 10:40:06 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:20 GMT
Subject: Re: HP48: Code Objects in User Language Programs
Message-ID: <276de832:1452.1comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.joehorn
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <kskalb.661187537 at faui1f>
Lines: 60

Klaus Kalb asks how to include pre-written Code objects inside
user-code programs without assembling the entire program.

A very handy way is to use Rick Grevelle's PRG-> and ->PRG routines
(posted here earlier) with ROLL and ROLLD.

---------------------------Example:--------------------------------

I have a Code object stored in 'JUNK'.  I have a program that looks
like this: << A B C + JUNK * >>  but I want the program to look
like this: << A B C + Code * >>.  Here's how to do it:

1)  << A B C + JUNK * >>   (this is the original program)
2)  PRG->   (decomposes program into its objects + count (8))
3)  4 ROLL   (this pulls JUNK down from level 4 to level 1)
4)  RCL   (this replaces JUNK with its Code contents)
5)  4 ROLLD  (this puts the Code into level 4, where JUNK was)
6)  ->PRG   (this recomposes the program into a single object)
7)  See << A B C + Code * >> on the stack!

Steps 3 and 5 are done easily by using the interactive stack.  In
fact, this application is the only time I use the interactive
stack.

If more than one replacement is to be made, steps 3 through 5 can
be automated (if you have Donnelly's Tool Library) this way:
->LIST 'JUNK' DUP RCL REPLACE OBJ->.  That'll replace every 'JUNK'
with its contents throughout the whole program.  Global search and
replace on program objects!  Can't do THAT on most handhelds!

Of course, this method can be used to insert "External"s and
anything else your heart desires into programs.  You don't ever
have to assemble the whole thing like we used to do!  Now you can
write a chunk at a time, verify that each chunk works, and then
tack the chunks together with ->PRG.

PRG-> by Rick Grevelle, in ASC format.
      String checksum: # CE4Dh.
ASC'd object checksum: # 3925h.
-----[ PRG-> begin ]-----
%%HP:;
"D9D202BA812BF81F3040379C1B21305293"
-----[ PRG-> end ]-----

->PRG by Rick Grevelle, in ASC format.
      String checksum: # 7844h.
ASC'd object checksum: # CEC5h.
-----[ ->PRG begin ]-----
%%HP:;
"D9D2043C8154450B21305CEC"
-----[ ->PRG end ]-----

Usage: Place a program object in level 1.  Press PRG->.  See the
program's objects in levels 2 through n, and find n in level 1.
PRG-> converts a program object into a meta-object.

Place objects in levels 2 through n, and place n in level 1, and
press ->PRG.  See the objects combined into a program object in
level 1.  ->PRG converts a meta-object into a program object.

--  Joseph K. Horn  --  (714) 858-0920  --  Peripheral Vision, Ltd.
#! rnews 608
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.dnickel at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Derek Scott Nickel)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 23:40:08 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:56 GMT
Subject: Re: Units problem....
Message-ID: <276d550f:1450.2comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.dnickel
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <1990Dec16.220615.5132 at zip.eecs.umich.edu> <1990Dec16.225234.6000 at z
Lines: 3

The HP 48SX, by design, only stores unit exponents as integers.

        Derek S. Nickel
#! rnews 2006
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bgribble at jarthur.claremont.edu (Bill Gribble)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 19:12:10 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:57 GMT
Subject: graphics stuff (attn: erikmb at cd.chalmers.se)
Message-ID: <10167 at jarthur.Claremont.EDU>
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!jarthur!jarthur.claremont.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: bgribble at jarthur.Claremont.EDU
Lines: 28

I've been trying to get mail through to the author of Tetris, the part-ml
  version, but my mailer pukes on his address.  So, Erik, if you're
  reading, please answer this if you have the time.  If you're not Erik,
  but know the answer to the question, feel free to answer.  Thanks.

========================= start included stuff here =======================

I'm trying to figure out a few things about graphics, and am having problems
  with one area - how to select a grob as the one being displayed.  I'm
  talking about machine language here, of course.  In your Tetris program,
  you managed to make the GRAPH grob the current one from inside the program.  
  How did you go about this?  I've experimented with the pointers at #7055x
  or so, but changing them always causes a system halt - even just switching 
  current-grob pointer to indicate the graph-grob.  Any light you can shed
  would be appreciated greatly.

Also, I'd like to help out with your password program, if you still need 
  people to betatest.

Since I'm leaving here Dec 23, an answer before then would be nice (if
  you have the time).

Thanks in advance for any help you can give.

*****************************************************************************
**   Bill Gribble                     Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA   **
**   bgribble at jarthur.claremont.edu   Never heard of it?  You're stupid.   **
*****************************************************************************
#! rnews 1041
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: @vms3.macc.wisc.edu:KAUFMAN at LUCI.DecNet (KAUFMAN)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 1990 23:56:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:57 GMT
Subject: <None>
Message-ID: <20121517564300 at vms3.macc.wisc.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!shelby!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 7
To: HANDHELDS at gac.edu
Return-path: <KAUFMAN%LUCI.DecNet at vms3.macc.wisc.edu>
To: HANDHELDS at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: WIRCS3::IN%"HANDHELDS at GAC.EDU"

I'm looking for information on the subject of double-precision arithmetic on
the HP-28S. In Eric Toonen's list of SYSEVAL numbers, some mention of
double-precision numbers was made, and now my curiosity is piqued. Does the 28S
have double precision capability, and if so, what operations are supported. I
realize one would need to write ML routines to do the dirty work, and that the
display surely cannot handle them, but does anyone have any info on this?

							TheSeeker
#! rnews 651
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: TDSTRONG%MTUS5.BITNET at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU (Tim Strong)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 20:53:52 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:58 GMT
Subject: HP48SX Internals
Message-ID: <37A2037FE0001860 at gacvx2.gac.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!shelby!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 3
To: HANDHELDS at gac.edu
Return-path: <@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU:TDSTRONG at MTUS5.BITNET>
To: HANDHELDS at gac.edu

Thank you for the copy of the internals document.

I post this so I don't get 30 or more copies in the next few days.
#! rnews 931
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: schram at boulder.Colorado.EDU (SCHRAM STEVEN P)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:13:40 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:58 GMT
Subject: minehunt
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.021340.7692 at csn.org>
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ncar!boulder!csn!news
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: news at csn.org
Reply-To: schram at tramp.Colorado.EDU (SCHRAM STEVEN P)
Lines: 9
Nntp-Posting-Host: tramp.colorado.edu

I've got a minehunt game for the 28s.  I was wondering if anyone (especially
the authors) would mind if I posted it, since it is a copyrighted game, or
at least I think so.  Could some authority on the subject give me a hand
on this one?  Thanks.


**************************************
*signature under construction.
**************************************
#! rnews 1464
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: NELSON%VWSCYG at vmsc.oac.uci.edu (Matthew A. Nelson)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 20:06:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:58 GMT
Subject: Equation library weirdness
Message-ID: <38F3728E60001869 at gacvx2.gac.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 15
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <NELSON%VWSCYG at vmsc.oac.uci.edu>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: UCI::IN%"handhelds at gac.edu"

Hello, all.
  I just encountered some weirdness in the equation library card's 
periodic table.  I needed to know the heat of vaporization for liquid
nitrogen.  "Ah ha," me thinks, "that's in the 48's periodic table."
When I looked it up, it gave me a value of 2.7928 kJ/mol.  Great.
The only problem was that when I compared the results of my calculations
to those my boss worked out, I was exactly a factor of 2 off.  It turns
out that when the equation library gives 2.8 kJ/mol, it is talking about
per mole of N, not per mole of N2.  For cryin' out loud, who has ever heard
of LN1 ?!  When I finally figured this out, I went digging in the manual,
and found no mention of this rather odd way to present physical properties.
  I guess that I can assume that this 'atomic standard' is the usual for
the equation library.
  Just thought that I'd pass the info along...

  -matt
#! rnews 1797
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: TNA32 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU (FRINGE)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 01:00:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:58 GMT
Subject: off
Message-ID: <EAA618DE39FFE0AB29 at ISUVAX.BITNET>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 112
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <TNA32 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: IN%"handhelds at gac.edu"

a while back someone posted a blurb wnating to know about programs that
came up when you turned the calculator on.  I posted, but it never made
it to the net.  Oh well, I'll try again.

As Xeno posted earlier, just assign a program to the off sequence (blue-on)
and have the program execute an off command.  Here's mine as an example.
to turn the calculator on, press on and hold the + key until the menu appears.
beep+ and beep- will enable or disable respectively, the beep for this
session with the calculator . (I found this kind of handy in exams)

%%HP: T(3)A(D)F(.);

\<<

  DO

    DO OFF

    UNTIL KEY

    END

  UNTIL 95 ==

  END CLLCD -57 CF

  IF -17 FS?

  THEN

"RAD MODE: ON" 1

DISP

  ELSE

    IF -18 FC?

    THEN

"RAD MODE: OFF" 1

DISP

    END

  END

  IF -15 FC? -16

FC? AND

  THEN "RECT. MODE"

2 DISP

  ELSE "POLAR MODE"

2 DISP

  END

  IF -19 FC?

  THEN "2D VECTORS"

3 DISP

  ELSE "COMPLEX #"

3 DISP

  END

  IF -49 FC? -50

FC? AND

  THEN "STD MODE" 4

DISP

  ELSE

    IF -49 FS? -50

FS? AND

    THEN "ENG MODE"

4 DISP

    END

  END -61 SF -62 SF

{ "BEEP+" "BEEP-" }

TMENU -1 WAIT

  IF 11.1 SAME

  THEN -56 CF

  ELSE -56 SF

  END 2 MENU

\>>



           -Mike
#! rnews 806
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: TNA32 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU (FRINGE)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 00:56:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:59 GMT
Subject: A models...again
Message-ID: <EAA6B534811FE0AB29 at ISUVAX.BITNET>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!spool2.mu.edu!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 10
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <TNA32 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: IN%"handhelds at gac.edu"

Good news to all of you with the VERY bug ridden A model 48SX.


HP IS NOW REPLACING THEM.


Call up the service center (NOT TECH SUPPORT) and tell them you have a 
A model 48SX.  Voila, "Send it in and we'll upgrade it"

Merry x-mas!
      Mike
#! rnews 633
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.rtwilson at hpcvbbs.UUCP (robert wilson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 03:40:06 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:59 GMT
Subject: 48 internals?
Message-ID: <276d8591:1455comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.rtwilson
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: internals
Lines: 3

Is there a comprehensive source of info for the 48sx? I'm looking for
memory maps of the i/o as well as internal architecture and development
-where can I get this information????????  bob
#! rnews 534
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.rtwilson at hpcvbbs.UUCP (robert wilson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 03:40:07 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:59 GMT
Subject: assembler
Message-ID: <276d85fa:1456comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.rtwilson
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: assembler
Lines: 1

can the assembler STAR be found on this bbs? I sure could use it there!
thanks someone....bob
#! rnews 899
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: olling at trc.jnoc.go.jp (Cliff Olling)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 05:11:44 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:48:59 GMT
Subject: Is Sharp's Wizard considered a handheld?
Message-ID: <102 at trc.jnoc.go.jp>
Organization: Japan National Oil Corporation, Chiba City, Japan
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!apple!sun-barr!ccut!trc!olling
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: olling at jnoc.go.jp (Cliff Olling)
Reply-To: olling at trc.jnoc.go.jp (Cliff Olling)
Lines: 6

In any case, please *E-MAIL* to me if you have any such product made my
Sharp, Casio, Canon, etc.
--
Clifford Olling  Japan National Oil Corporation    $@@PL}8xCD(J
Technology Research Center  $@@PL}3+H/5;=Q(J  Chiba City, Japan
olling at jnoc.go.jp    $@KkD%K\6?1X(J   24hrs/day=>81+472-73-5831
#! rnews 1640
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: caloccia at lectroid.sw.stratus.com (William Caloccia)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 07:20:21 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:12 GMT
Subject: HP48SX --  On/Off detection from alarm-driven program
Message-ID: <3481 at lectroid.sw.stratus.com>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!samsung!crackers!transfer!lectroid!caloccia
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: usenet at lectroid.sw.stratus.com
Reply-To: caloccia at stratus.com (William Caloccia)
Keywords: timing alarms
Lines: 26


	I've managed to figure out a correction for my HP48 so that the
clock is closer to 3 seconds a month than 3 seconds a day off.  The
correction is an alarm, which adjusts the clock every half hour.

	I don't want the calculator to stay on 1/3 of the time (10 minutes
to time out after the alarm), nor do I want to have it turn off while I'm
trying to use it.

	One suggestion was to use a program (bound to a USR key, etc) that
simply did  	<< 6 SF OFF 6 CF >>  and to then add a test to the
alarm to check for the flag being set.  However, it appears that when
the calculator goes to service the alarm, the unexecuted portion of the
'off' program ('6 CF') is executed and then the alarm is executed,
and since the Flag is then clear. the calculator is left on.

	Has anyone else succeeded in doing this kind of thing ?

	(yes, I can turn the calculator back on, but it is awfully annoying
	 when you're in the middle of something -- bad enough that the
	 edit/entry area is blown away by the alarm..)

	Any suggestions would be apreciated...

	thanks,
	--bill
#! rnews 741
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: LIGUORO%IPACRES.BITNET at ICNUCEVM.CNUCE.CNR.IT (CRAZY_FINGERS)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 11:09:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:21 GMT
Subject: Unsubscribe from this list.
Message-ID: <EAE7FD7BB47F2054B1 at IPACRES.BITNET>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!ns-mx!iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 1
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <@ICNUCEVM.CNUCE.CNR.IT:LIGUORO at IPACRES.BITNET>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: IN%"handhelds at gac.edu"

UNSUB HANDHELDS
#! rnews 5504
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jbb at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Jim B. Byers)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:44:25 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:00 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <101950173 at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Corvallis, OR, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvlx!jbb
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 101


OK, now we are getting somewhere.  I understand you to be saying
the following things.

1)  You are using an HP-UX machine.
2)  Do not have a support contract because your organization decided
    not to.
3)  You have only had access to the net for the past quarter.
4)  You have need for some X11 based programs that you have seen.
    Someone on your site compiled them for another machine, but not for
    HP-UX.
5)  You would be willing to compile them if you have to. (It is assumed
    that you would prefer a binary.
6)  You need the Athena widgets to compile these it.  You want these to
    be shipped as part of HP-UX.  If you were on support you would expect
    us to bug fix these and work with you on work arounds etc.
7)  You also need a copy of GKS.  I take this to mean the xgks stuff
    found in the contrib section of the MIT tape under 
    contrib/libraries/xgks
8)  You cannot install the MIT tape and build what you want due to space
    constraints.
9)  You are angry and are letting us know.

Lets cover these.

 
Re: 4)  You have some X11 programs that you want to use.  These are
applications that you have seen, that may be available as source.  I 
understand these to be PD rather than purchased applications.  I still
am not sure what these are.  In the past requests for such binaries have
been fulfilled by the net.  Someone took the time to compile them for
use on another system on your site.  Other sites across the country 
probably have compiled them for HP-UX.  Give the net a try.  No vendor
will ever provide every PD application that is passed around on the net.  Why would they, they
Why would they?  They are passed around quite efficiently on the net :-).


Re: 5)  The obvious problem here is obtaining the right patches etc. to
the MIT tape.  I know you have a great faith in the MIT tape software
(even in the contrib) section but it is software whose major goal is
features not stable code.  This is not to say that the contributors,
HP included, do not strive for good code.  My point is that this is the
first time that much of this code has seen the light of day.

Re: 6)  I would recommend that you consider ftp-ing the libraries from
hpcvaaz as Harry describes in his response.  You would prefer that
these were included in HP-UX.  This is a tough one.  We wrestled with
this one when the Athena widgets first came out (R2).As you mentioned
people would expect us to support/bug fix them if they were in HP-UX.
It frankly has not come up as much of an issue as the libraries are
available via hpcvaaz and most commercial developers use Motif if they
are widgeteers.  In short we (here on the X11/Motif/VUE team ) haven't
heard many complaints. Really.

We still would have had a problem satisfying you with the 7.0 release.
The 7.0 release was completed *before* R4 came out.  So we would have
had to rely on hpcvaaz to satisfy your needs. 

In a similar vain you want the latest thing on the net but want it
to be there in the last standard release.  You expect these to be
bug free and part of an extremely stable release.  This is hard to
deliver on!  Are these goals mutually exclusive or am I missing
something?

Re: 7)  GKS has been on the HP-UX boxes for a long time.  It has always
been available as a separate product.  Since you need a PD type version
you probably are talking about the xgks from the contrib/toolkit section
of the MIT tape.  As a point of reference, there are 9 toolkits in this
section.  I have no direct info on xgks, since I have never been asked
about it.  How about posting a request on the net (sansflames) and see
what kind of response you get.  Figraro from template as well as an
HP implementation of Phigs can be purchased.  PEX from the X consortium
is still rather young (I believe) and is I am unsure of its availability
outside the consortium.  Someone else will have to help out on this.

Re: 8)  The size of the MIT tape is huge, agreed.  There are many parts
to it.  Different people are interested in different parts.  Thats the
beauty of PD software, but it is unrealistic to expect all vendors
to ship all parts to all people for "free".

Re: 9)  Personally I thinks flames can be a good sign.  The person
obviously feels strongly about the subject.  On the other hand, keep
in mind that if you really want answers, it is not unreasonable to
try a more straight forward query first.  The Athena widgets have
been on hpcvaaz for a long time.  Various people on the net have
R4 binaries/source.  All these could have been found without extrainious
heat.


I was very serious about the fact that compatibility is religion here.
While I am involved with only X11/Motif here which makes me naive 
(as each of us is - knowing only a small fraction of the world's
knowledge) I know the immense amount of importance it take on here.

I am glad to have read your comments.  And I hope that this helps!  

Jim Byers
ITO Marketing/Lab Team

"Never attribute malice where ignorance will suffice."
				A rule for living
#! rnews 4071
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jsadler at misty.boeing.com (Jim Sadler)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 1990 04:58:16 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:01 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <1150056 at misty.boeing.com>
Organization: Boeing Commercial Airplane BCS Support
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!bcstec!misty!jsadler
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 84

/ misty:comp.sys.hp / mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay) /  7:01 am  Dec 13, 1990 /
>Hi HP people,
>
>	I hear that  HPUX 8.0 will be shipped out in June or July.
>I also hear that X11R4 will be send with it.  That is, if you have
>`software support.'
>
>	What if you don't have software support?  [Gripes about
>HP policy left for later.]  Will someone please make a tar file of the
>distribution tape, and put it somewhere?  Or send the tar file to those
>of us who have no support from HP?

	Why should you get the additions that HP put into X for free, while
	I have to pay for it ?
	As you say below X is in the "public domain", I beleive it's
	not.  It is freely distributed.  If you want it, why not ftp it
	from uunet or mit.
>
>	My local HP rep was confused when I told her I knew of
>people with X11R4 on an HP.  She seems to think that it hasn't been
>released yet.  People have it, though!

	As they say not all reps are created equal and its not always
	the reps fault.  The 842 and 852 intro is a good example.  The
	sales force didn't know about them until a few days before they
	were introduced.  They didn't get briefed until after the intro
	and some of the magazines knew about them way before the field
	offices.  I think marketing at Corp HQ. messed but good.
>
>	Why does the X11R3 that comes with HPUX 7.0 not include
>some of the X routines that many public programs expect?  Will X11R4
>lack this hideous problem?

	Good question !  I'd sure like to know!  It's not restricted to
	just X either other libraries are missing !!
>
>	Why does HP consider fixing their software bugs (called an update
>of the OS) something for which you have to pay big money for a
>support contract?  It is unfair.  If you pay for UNIX, you should get UNIX,
>and not have to pay incrementally to have HP give you UNIX over a period
>of time.  It isn't as if the machine was inexpensive up front.  It isn't as if
>HPUX is not the most incompatible port of UNIX and X on the planet. It 
>most certainly is NOT that new versions of the OS are improvements
>to UNIX.  The new versions are bug fixes.  That is not right.

	I kinda agree somewhat, except for the "most incompatible" try
	Xenix or apollo "UN*X".  Software only update service is $600
	per year list.  I would think that it would be cheaper than that
	for you with the edu discount.  The last time I check Sun and
	DEC charged for their update service.  Is it competative ??
>
>	X is in the public domain.  HP makes so called `inhancements'
>(read "incompatible frilly fluff")  to it and sells it for money. 

			Stuff deleted.


	I really do wish HP would provide libraries and utilities that
	are more upto date.
>
>	For now, I run many of the X apps I need on a Sparc, and just
>have the Sparc use my display.  EtherNet is wonderful.  xhost + is
>fantastic.  My HPUX is being used as a dumb X terminal!!!  I'd like it
>to evolve into something more useful.

	While ours aren't "dumb X terminal"'s.  I understand the
	feeling.
>
>	Thank you in advance for your reply,
>	Mike Gourlay
>	mike at penguin.gatech.edu
>
>--------------------------------------------
>I don't officially speak for Georgia Tech or GTRI;  Why the hell
>should they care if I'm unhappy with HPUX, just because I work
>with it every single day?  The upper echelons have Sparcs and SGI's.
>----------

jim sadler
206-234-9009	email	uunet!bcstec!jsadler | jsadler at misty.boeing.com

This service is brought to you by the computing mafia of Boeing (BCS).
Oh ya
None of the above is an opinion of The Boeing Co.  
#! rnews 3230
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jsadler at misty.boeing.com (Jim Sadler)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 21:46:28 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:01 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <1150057 at misty.boeing.com>
Organization: Boeing Commercial Airplane BCS Support
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!bcstec!misty!jsadler
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 56

/ misty:comp.sys.hp / harry at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney) /  1:29 pm  Dec 14, 1990 /
>Mike Gourlay writes:
	
	MUCH DELETED.
>
>>	Why does the X11R3 that comes with HPUX 7.0 not include
>> some of the X routines that many public programs expect?
>
>We do not ship some of the libraries distributed in the MIT X Consortium
>distribution because of possible support problems.  It may appear to be
>bureaucratic overhead, but for us to release a product we have to show
>that we've adequately tested it.  This involves having a test suite
>which covers a certain percentage of the paths through the code, and
>enough test hours (with few enough bugs found) to ensure that the
>customer will be able to make good use of the product.  We simply do not
>have the "engineering resources" (i.e.  enough people) to adequately
>test all of the various pieces of the public X11 release.
>
   I can accept the above.  But why doesn't HP provide the untested code
   as "user supported" ?  DEC does this with their install tapes.  I'm
   not sure, but I believe they do it for no extra charge (at least it
   doesn't show up as a seperate charge).  This is the first time that I
   have heard why HP doesn't ship certain libraries, up till now I
   thought someone was makeing capricious and arbitrary decisions on what
   to not included with HP-UX.  Is the above reason why certain berkley
   utilities and librarys are missing ?
	MORE DELETED.
>
>While ranting and flaming may make one feel a bit better during moments
    					                         ^^^^^^^
	Two points I'd like to make:  1.  If it was just moments that
	happened occasionally, I would agree with you.  When it happens
	week after week in the normal  course of your work it gets
	extremely fustrating.  Please don't think I agree with
	everything that Mr. Gourlay say's, I don't, but I do empathize
	with him.  These feeling are compounded if you work in a
	multi-vendor shop and you can walk to a brand X machine and it
	does what the HP didn't.
	2.  Please, Please don't take my or anyone else postings
	personally.  Most of the time the reason I make critical type
	postings is because I can't get the real information anyother
	way and I hope it might influence someone to correct my perceived
	problem.
>of frustration, it doesn't help motivate anyone else to provide
>assistance.  Also, saying thank you at the end does little to remove the
>bitter taste of the preceding flames.
>
>Harry Phinney   harry at cv.hp.com
>----------

jim sadler
206-234-9009	email	uunet!bcstec!jsadler | jsadler at misty.boeing.com

This service is brought to you by the computing mafia of Boeing (BCS).
Oh ya
None of the above is an opinion of The Boeing Co.  
#! rnews 5370
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: frank at grep.co.uk (Frank Wales)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 17:17:42 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:13 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.171742.1309 at grep.co.uk>
Organization: Grep Limited, LEEDS, UK
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!mcsun!ukc!mucs!logitek!grep!frank
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Reply-To: frank at grep.co.uk (Frank Wales)
Keywords: HPUX 8.0 help X11R4 gripe
Lines: 111

[Disclaimer: I am not, and never have been, an employee of HP, 
 just a long-time satified customer, blah-blah-blah.]

In article <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu> mikeg at dali.gatech.edu 
(Mike Gourlay) writes:
>	I hear that  HPUX 8.0 will be shipped out in June or July.
>I also hear that X11R4 will be send with it.  That is, if you have
>`software support.'
>
>	What if you don't have software support?  [Gripes about
>HP policy left for later.]  Will someone please make a tar file of the
>distribution tape, and put it somewhere?  Or send the tar file to those
>of us who have no support from HP?

What a good idea.  But why stop with HP?  Why not make copies of all
the common OSs from all vendors and put them somewhere public?  Why
bother actually paying for them at all?  After all, they cost nothing
to develop, duplicate and distribute, right?

>	Why does HP consider fixing their software bugs (called an update
>of the OS) something for which you have to pay big money for a
>support contract?

Most software updates include new commands, new facilities and performance
or compatibility improvements which are worth actually paying for.  And
remember that much of the code in HP-UX wasn't actually written by HP
at all.  When was the last time you had to debug a two million line package
you didn't write?

>It is unfair.

No, it isn't.  Name any commercial vendor who will provide on-going
support and updates completely free of charge.

>If you pay for UNIX, you should get UNIX, and not have to pay
>incrementally to have HP give you UNIX over a period of time.

Huh?  I wasn't aware that I was getting HP-UX on the installment plan.
UNIX is a moving target from any vendor, which is one reason why software
updates exist and cost money.

>It isn't as if the machine was inexpensive up front.

I find HP machines quite competitive for price/performance, especially
when cost of ownership and reliability are considered.

>It isn't as if HPUX is not the most incompatible port of UNIX and 
>X on the planet.

It doesn't sound like you've ported much to HP-UX that wasn't Sun or
VAX dependent.  It's very accommodating of foreign software.

>It most certainly is NOT that new versions of the OS are improvements
>to UNIX.  The new versions are bug fixes.  That is not right.

You are correct; the statements preceding "That is not right" are not right.

How many new versions have you seen?  How many other vendors' versions
of UNIX have you seen?  How do you determine whose is better?

>	X is in the public domain.

No, it isn't.  It's freely distributable within certain constraints.

>HP makes so called `inhancements'
>(read "incompatible frilly fluff")  to it and sells it for money. 

Sun, AT&T, DEC, and most other workstation vendors also make enhancements.
Is everyone evil?

>X should be compilable from the distribution
>at MIT, and so capable people should be able to compile X11R4 without
>waiting for the newest distribution from HP.  Has anyone done that?

You said earlier that they had.  Besides, how long do you think it takes
to test something the size of X, especially when you didn't write it?
How long does it take to distribute zillions of copies of it?  Do you
think HP are just dawdling because they feel like it?

>My local rep blaimed it on inherent incompatibilities in UNIX.  WHAT?!?!?!!?
>That's ridiculous.  Inherent incompatibilities in UNIX?  No such thing.

See Configure by Larry Wall for some idea of the nonexistent
incompatibilities between different UNIX versions.  Read comp.unix.* and
comp.lang.c for some more.

>Between SYSV and BSD, okay.

Which one of these isn't UNIX, since obviously they can't both be
(UNIX isn't incompatible with itself, after all)?

>Between _either_ BSD or SYSV and HPUX, I see incompatibility
>(or is it incompetence?)

Ahem.  HP-UX is one of the most reliable UNIX versions I know of.  It got
that way because HP actually debug the thing before they ship it, unlike
certain other workstation vendors I could mention.  Their implementation
of some things is also cleaner (e.g., context-dependent files versus mutant
symlink file systems from Hell).  Maybe you're not prepared to pay for
reliability, and want Untested Creeping Features (tm) instead.  Maybe
that puts you in the minority of HP's customers.

>That, according to her, is why WE HAVE TO PAY HP TO GIVE US PUBLIC
>DOMAIN SOFTWARE AND BUG FIXES TO THEIR WEIRD, BUGGY, INCOMPLETE UNIX
>PORT AND SPECIAL VERSION OF X.

For some reason, the phrase "eat my shorts" comes to mind.  It always
seems to happen when someone's BIFF key gets stuck down.  Can't imagine why.
--
Frank Wales, Grep Limited,             [frank at grep.co.uk<->uunet!grep!frank]
Kirkfields Business Centre, Kirk Lane, LEEDS, UK, LS19 7LX. (+44) 532 500303
#! rnews 3384
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: gordon at maxwell.waterloo.edu (Gordon R. Strachan)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 13:57:19 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:15 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.135719.25336 at sunee.waterloo.edu>
Organization: University of Waterloo
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!agate!bionet!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!watserv1!sunee!maxwell!gordon
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu> <101950173 at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com>
Sender: daemon at sunee.waterloo.edu
Lines: 61

In article <101950173 at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com> jbb at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Jim B. Byers) writes:
>
>OK, now we are getting somewhere.  I understand you to be saying
>the following things.
>
>1)  You are using an HP-UX machine.
>2)  Do not have a support contract because your organization decided
>    not to.
>3)  You have only had access to the net for the past quarter.
>4)  You have need for some X11 based programs that you have seen.
>    Someone on your site compiled them for another machine, but not for
>    HP-UX.

stuff deleted

>Lets cover these.
>
> 
>Re: 6)  I would recommend that you consider ftp-ing the libraries from
>hpcvaaz as Harry describes in his response.  You would prefer that
>these were included in HP-UX.  This is a tough one.  We wrestled with
>this one when the Athena widgets first came out (R2).As you mentioned
>people would expect us to support/bug fix them if they were in HP-UX.
>It frankly has not come up as much of an issue as the libraries are
>available via hpcvaaz and most commercial developers use Motif if they
>are widgeteers.  In short we (here on the X11/Motif/VUE team ) haven't
>heard many complaints. Really.
>
>

Okay, I interpret this to say that unless we complain, we won't get the Athena
widget set shipped in v8.0.  So okay, I'm complaining! I want the Athena
widgets put into the standard HP distribution.

What you say is in essentially correct.  When I write X programs I use the
motif widgets because they are better than the Athena widgets.  But, the
problem comes when you want to compile public domain code, the vast
majority of which still use the Athena widgets.  I don't think it is such a
big deal for HP to stick the library in the distribution and mark it as
unsupported.  After all, wasn't that what the /usr/contrib directory was for,
unsupported contributed software?  At least make it an option for those of us
that want it.  The lack of Athena widgets and totally brain dead man page names
for the Xt library functions are the two biggest problems with HP's X software.

I would like to add though, that on the hole I am quite happy with HP's X
software.  I don't consider HP's additions to the X server to be minor.  The
reason I never installed the R4 stuff from MIT is I didn't want to lose these
additions, most notably the starbase extensions.  Also, I have been satisfied
with HP software support.  It seems to me, although this is just subjective,
that HP has a lot more updates than other major vendors (ie Sun) and their
O/S is more stable.  The software support is expensive but, so far at least, I
think it has been worth the money.

>
>I am glad to have read your comments.  And I hope that this helps!  
>
>Jim Byers
>ITO Marketing/Lab Team


Gordon
#! rnews 1412
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: chan at hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Chan Benson)
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 18:07:25 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 20:23:11 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <17780002 at hpfcmgw.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, CO
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!chan
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.7.5 (840 Contrib) 87/2/5; site hpfcmgw.HP.COM
References: <1990Dec14.095519.14818 at hellgate.utah.edu>


Well, I seem to be having some problems with getting my "remove foot
from mouth" posting posted. So if you see this multiple times, I 
apologize.

In a previous note, I wrote...

>> Does speed not matter?  The Sparcs are much (10x?) faster.
>
>I'm willing to admit some advantages to Sun, but the Sparcstation I is
>about the same performance as the 400t.  At the worst the multiplier is
>some number greater than one and less than two.  It's certainly nowhere
>near ten.
>
>			-- Chan
>
>If all the false statistics presented on usenet in a year were placed
>end to end they would circle the equator 50,000 times.

I inadvertantly added a few yards of misinformation of my own. I should
have qualified the above statement with the word "integer". Floating point
performance on the SparcStation is about 3-4 times faster than a 68030
based 400t. The 68040 upgrade narrows that gap substantially.

			-- Chan

#! rnews 1407
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rsh at hpfcdc.HP.COM (Scott Holbrook)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 20:16:50 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:22 GMT
Subject: Re: indir and #!
Message-ID: <5570553 at hpfcdc.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, Co.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hpfcdc!rsh
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.3  1990/04/18; site hpfcdc.HP.COM
References: <5713 at uafhp.uark.edu>

> I am trying to install indir on an HP 375.  I have gotten it to
> compile, but when I try to execute a script like:

> #!/usr/local/bin/indir some list of arguments

> My shell reports to me that the file cannot be executed.

As documented in exec(2) (talking about #! scripts):

    If the initial line of the script exceeds a system defined
    maximum number of characters, exec fails.  The minimum value
    for this limit is 32.

Indeed, the limit in HP-UX is 32 characters.  My guess is that your
line is exceeding this limit.

> Is there something I need to do to enable this or is it not
> supported under HP-UX?

There is no way that you can change the 32 byte limit.  You can either
shorten your first line (perhaps move 'indir' to someplace with a
shorter path), or make the script a sh(1) script that simply runs

    /usr/local/bin/indir some list of arguments

Scott Holbrook / rsh at hpfcla.fc.hp.com
HP-UX Development Lab
#! rnews 1866
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: cedman at golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 02:32:05 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:01 GMT
Subject: Re: The "getdtablesize" command
Message-ID: <CEDMAN.90Dec17183310 at lynx.ps.uci.edu>
Organization: University of California, Irvine, USA.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!orion.oac.uci.edu!cedman
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu>
Lines: 24
Nntp-Posting-Host: lynx.ps.uci.edu
In-reply-to: preetham at ra.src.umd.edu's message of 17 Dec 90 23:00:17 GMT

In article <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu> preetham at ra.src.umd.edu (Preetham Gopalaswamy) writes:
   I am trying to compile a software package that was unfortunately not written
   for SysV although they claim that it is.   The computer being used is an HP800
   running HPUX 3.1.   One of the problems that I am facing is finding a SysV
   equivalent for the command "getdtablesize" which is used (so the SUN man
   pages say) to "get the descriptor table size".   What can I use instead of
   this command since it does not exist on the HPs.
   Any help would be appreciated.   Thanks in advance.

getdtablesize() is a BSD command to find (basically) the maximum
number of files open at the same time. The corresponding HPUX command
is sysconf(_SC_OPEN_MAX). The correct include file for this is <unistd.h>.
Simply replace getdtablesize by sysconf everywhere, or better, define
getdtablesize, compile it, and add this function to your BSD library.
Then you will never again have to worry about it.

        Carl Edman



Theorectical Physicist,N.:A physicist whose  | Send mail
existence is postulated, to make the numbers |  to
balance but who is never actually observed   | cedman at golem.ps.uci.edu
in the laboratory.                           | edmanc at uciph0.ps.uci.edu
#! rnews 4990
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rkl at and.cs.liv.ac.uk
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 11:37:09 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:15 GMT
Subject: Some Q&A's about HP-UX 8.0 and X11R4
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.113709.8929 at and.cs.liv.ac.uk>
Organization: Computer Science, Liverpool University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!mcsun!ukc!mucs!liv-cs!rkl
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>
Lines: 98

In article <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu>,
mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay) writes:

> Hi HP people,

I don't work for HP, but we have a large installation of HP-UX workstations
here, so I'm slightly qualified to comment :-)

> 	I hear that  HPUX 8.0 will be shipped out in June or July.
> I also hear that X11R4 will be send with it.  That is, if you have
> `software support.'

I'm waiting for disk quotaing with 8.0 myself (and will it work across
NFS ?). X11R4 is a dead subject - we got our copy FTP'ed directly from a
US archive 2 days after it was announced. Even then, MIT supplied a
hacked-by-HP .o file for the X11R4 server, which was annoying when most/all
of the other target machines could compile from the C sources. We now compile
all PD stuff using MIT's X11R4 and we don't even touch HP's 7.0 X11 release.

> 	My local HP rep was confused when I told her I knew of
> people with X11R4 on an HP.  She seems to think that it hasn't been
> released yet.  People have it, though!

We do. You can order it from MIT on 4 tapes for a nominal fee.

> 	Will the X11R4 binaries running on HPUX 6.5 also run
> on a similar machine running 7.0?

Yes, here's the experience we've had:

Compiled on      Works on
HP  X11R2/6.5    HP X11R2/6.5, HP X11R3/7.0, MIT X11R4/7.0
HP  X11R3/7.0    HP X11R2/6.5, HP X11R3/7.0
MIT X11R4/7.0    HP X11R3/7.0 and MIT X11R4/7.0 - *not* under 6.5

Of course, font paths and libraries can cause problems, but there are
workarounds.

>  Specifically,  will the X binaries
> running on a HPUX 6.5 9000s319C+ run on a HPUX 7.0 9000s370?
> Libraries? Server? Client?

Should be OK, but I can't guarantee that.

> 	Why does the X11R3 that comes with HPUX 7.0 not include
> some of the X routines that many public programs expect?  Will X11R4
> lack this hideous problem?

Even the MIT release of X11R3 did not come with some of the libraries needed
by many PD X11R4 programs. This is a problem: HP lag 6-8 months behind MIT on
their releases...and they also tweak the MIT release, which is a bit naughty.

> 	Why does HP consider fixing their software bugs (called an update
> of the OS) something for which you have to pay big money for a
> support contract?  It is unfair.

It's disk quotaing that is possibly HP's biggest faux pas. That is a
desperately required feature of HP-UX, especially in an academic situation
with 100's of undergrads, and I feel that 8.0 should be 'free' to those
without a support contract, simply because rival manufacturer's (Sun springs
to mind) have had disk quotaing for many years.

> X should be compilable from the distribution
> at MIT, and so capable people should be able to compile X11R4 without
> waiting for the newest distribution from HP.  Has anyone done that?

Yes, but it was a big problem working out where to put MIT's X11R4. After
playing with dreaded cdf's, we've finally settled on a /MIT top level
(under which are the bin, include and lib dirs) soft-linked to a central
disk mounted via NFS. Customised scripts allow either version to be started
up (with separate ~/.x11start and ~/.mitstart startup files).

> That, according to her,
> is why WE HAVE TO PAY HP TO GIVE US PUBLIC DOMAIN SOFTWARE
> AND BUG FIXES TO THEIR WEIRD, BUGGY, INCOMPLETE UNIX
> PORT AND SPECIAL VERSION OF X.

I object to HP including an highly-modified release of Elm with 7.0 and
then removing any trace of the original author's names. We've renamed ours to
elm.7.0 (and newmail.7.0) and soft-linked elm and newmail to the latest PD
version (elm 2.3 PL9).

> 	For now, I run many of the X apps I need on a Sparc, and just
> have the Sparc use my display.  EtherNet is wonderful.  xhost + is
> fantastic.  My HPUX is being used as a dumb X terminal!!!  I'd like it
> to evolve into something more useful.

I'd recommend a minimum HP-UX configuration of 16MB RAM, preferably with
a colour display and at least a 300MB system disk. Diskless machines or
machines with <16MB RAM really do suffer massive peformance degradation
when running X.

Richard K. Lloyd,       *** This is a MicroVAX II running VAX/VMS V5.3-1 ***
Computer Science Dept., * JANET     : RKL at UK.AC.LIV.CS.AND                 *
Liverpool University,   * Internet  : RKL%and.cs.liv.ac.uk at cunyvm.cuny.edu *
Merseyside, England,    ****************************************************
Great Britain.          Q: "What's the world's fastest home micro ?"
L69 3BX                 A: "The Archimedes A3000. 4 MIPS for under 800 pounds."
#! rnews 1550
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: dayger at penelope.Oswego.EDU
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 09:27:13 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:21 GMT
Subject: DeskJet 500 / Elek Tek
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.092713.10191 at oswego.Oswego.EDU>
Organization: Instructional Computing Center, SUNY at Oswego, Oswego, NY
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uupsi!oswego!news
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: na
Reply-To: dayger at penelope.Oswego.EDU ()
Lines: 20

First; thanks to everyone who responded to my previous posting.  Judging from
the info I received from net-people as well as a visit to a local HP dealer,
I'm opting for a DeskJet 500.

However, before I decide where to buy from, there is one more company I want to
check with: Several of you mentioned "Elek Tek" in your responses, however, no
one really said very much about the company.  Can someone fill me in on about
these people: Where are they located?  How good is their service?  Contact
info? etc.

Thanks.

-Tim

 =============================================================================
 = Tim E. Dayger               |     Internet: dayger at oswego.oswego.edu      =
 = Systems Operator            |     Bitnet:   dayger%oswego at snyoswva.bitnet =
 = SUNY College at Oswego      |     UUCP:     ...!sunybcs!oswego!dayger     =
 = Oswego, NY  USA             |     DECNet:   oswego::dayger                =
 =============================================================================
#! rnews 3142
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: edwin at cs.ruu.nl (Edwin Kremer)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 08:39:19 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:22 GMT
Subject: SUMMARY: strange (?) behaviour of DAT drive
Message-ID: <4530 at ruuinf.cs.ruu.nl>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!think.com!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!mcsun!hp4nl!ruuinf!praxis!edwin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at ruuinf.cs.ruu.nl
Keywords: DAT, SCSI, HP-UX 7.0, HP9000/375
Lines: 62


Thanks very much to those who responded so quickly to my notes about
a somewhat strange behaviour of our DAT drive!

I'll start this summary some notes to clarify a couple of things that
should have appeared in my original message, but didn't:

	1) The DAT is a very new product. Late intro of the DAT in the
	   HP-UX 7.0 program caused its documentation not to make it
	   into the HP-UX 7.0 documentation set.
	2) You can buy two types of DAT drives: a stand-alone (unpack,
	   plug-in and play) version and a bare DAT unit that nicely fits
	   into the HP Series 6000 Mass Storage Systems (models 330S and
	   660S). We bought the latter one.
	3) Installing the DAT hardware was thoroughly documented in the
	   doc that came with the mass storage unit mentioned above.


Well, of course HP _knew_ that the DAT installation from the OS point
of view (device major/minor numbers, what to put in "/etc/conf/dfile",
etc.) wasn't documented in the HP-UX 7.0 manual set, so Paul Perlmutter
<paul at hppaul.fc.hp.com> wrote up a thorough summary, called "the DDS
Application Note".
  Unfortunately, this invaluable document was shipped with the stand-alone
DAT drive version only, not with the bare unit. So, we were just unlucky ;-)

Anyway, Paul Perlmutter mailed me an electronic copy of this document
that indeed clarifies a lot. Well done and thanks very much Paul!

In a followup to my message, Paul Perlmutter also states that:

	|> This is a bug in the 7.0 DAT driver.  It can be safely ignored.
	|>   The reason? After the tape is successfully ejected, the driver
	|> during the tape "close" routine will issue a reposition command
	|> to the non-cartridge and the request fails.


Sven Thjostarsson <award at uafhp.uark.edu> offered the following:

	|> Try: mt offl
	|> 
	|> I know that you are supposed to use mt on 0mn, not 0m. It will
	|> choose the proper device if you don't specify one in your case.

I verified this of course and he's right. If you used the default naming
scheme (/dev/rmt/0m and /dev/rmt/0mn), you do not have to provide device
names to the 'mt' or 'tar' commands. 'mt' will use the non-rewinding
device by default.


Well, that's it. I'm impressed by the amount (and speed) of support I got
from Paul Perlmutter in just one day. Great!


	thanks again and Merry Christmas,

						--[ Edwin ]--
--
Edwin Kremer (SysAdm), Dept. of Computer Science, Utrecht University
Padualaan 14,   P.O. Box 80.089,  3508 TB  Utrecht,  The Netherlands
Telephone: +31-30-534104  | UUCP: ...!uunet!mcsun!hp4nl!ruuinf!edwin
Telefax  : +31-30-513791  | Email: edwin at cs.ruu.nl    [131.211.80.5]
#! rnews 1076
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: randy at aplcomm.jhuapl.edu (RANDALL SCHRICKEL (NCE) x7661)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 13:14:38 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:22 GMT
Subject: Fault-tolerant HP-UX?
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.131438.4762 at aplcen.apl.jhu.edu>
Organization: JHU/APL, Laurel, MD
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen!aplcomm.jhuapl.edu!randy
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: usa
Sender: news at aplcen.apl.jhu.edu (USENET News System)
Reply-To: randy at aplcomm.jhuapl.edu (RANDALL SCHRICKEL (NCE) x7661)
Lines: 9

Saw a short blurb about the subject in Unix Today, or some magazine. Who can
tell me anything about it? Supposedly it can be used at sites with 2 or more
HPs, so that if one crashes the other will take over with no down time.
Pricing, reviews, any details would be appreciated. Thanx.
--
	Randy Schrickel randy at aplcomm.jhuapl.edu
	Johns Hopkins Applied Physics Lab
	Laurel, MD 20723
	"Life goes on, long after the thrill of living has gone."
#! rnews 1424
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: v087mxgb at ubvmsa.cc.buffalo.edu (Shawn E Thompson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 13:50:56 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 06:49:23 GMT
Subject: All you HP experts, please HELP me................
Message-ID: <52129 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU>
Organization: University at Buffalo
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!usc!cs.utexas.edu!rutgers!ub!ubvmsa.cc.buffalo.edu!v087mxgb
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at acsu.Buffalo.EDU
Reply-To: v087mxgb at ubvmsa.cc.buffalo.edu
Lines: 27
Nntp-Posting-Host: ubvmsa.cc.buffalo.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS V1.3-4.4



Hello all,

I am in dire straights......

My company uses an HP3000/960 for their MIS/data processing
dept. I in Engineering run a software package on a SUN
Sparcstation (no other choice, thats all it runs on)......

Anyway, we have a database system by ASK that requires
"block mode" terminal emulation. 

How can I emulate this on my Sparc so I can have access to
our HP and be a team player here ????




This is urgent, please offer any suggestion you can.

Thank you in advance.......

Shawn E. Thompson "..my sig file was so long, I'm not even allowed a quote..."
v087mxgb at ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu | set at autarch.acsu.buffalo.edu
University @ Buffalo|Graduate School of Mechanical Engineering
CAD Engineering|Leica, Inc.|PO Box 123|Buffalo, NY 14240-0123|(716)891-3375
#! rnews 1440
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 14:42:36 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:16 GMT
Subject: Performance of HP/Apollo 9000/425t???
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.144236.15864 at ccad.uiowa.edu>
Organization: CAD-Research, U. of Iowa, Iowa City, Iowa
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!ns-mx!ccad.uiowa.edu!timv
Newsgroups: comp.benchmarks,comp.sys.apollo,comp.sys.hp
Sender: timv at ccad.uiowa.edu (Timothy VanFosson)
Followup-to: comp.benchmarks
Lines: 18
Xref: hplabs comp.benchmarks:245 comp.sys.apollo:2093 comp.sys.hp:1999

I am interested in obtaining benchmark information for HP 9000/425t
workstations (if any of the '040 machines are actually out there :-).
SPECmarks would be of most interest as I can compare these with info
from other vendors.  If you have other benchmarks I would be interested
in seeing results for it on other workstations so I have a basis for
comparision.  I do NOT need MIPS or MFLOPS ratings, I have these.

BTW, I would be running DOMAIN/OS, but results from either environment
would be useful.

Thanks,
--tv

-- 
Timothy VanFosson                   E-mail   : timv at ccad.uiowa.edu
Senior Systems Analyst              US Mail  : CAD-Research
University of Iowa                             228 ERF
Phone : (319) 335-5728                         Iowa City, Iowa 52242
#! rnews 1108
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: gaspar at urz.unibas.ch
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 10:36:11 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 14:44:17 GMT
Subject: LasetJet print driver for DeskJet?
Message-ID: <1990Dec18.113611.1256 at urz.unibas.ch>
Organization: University of Basel, Switzerland
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!ucsd!usc!samsung!uunet!mcsun!cernvax!chx400!urz.unibas.ch!gaspar
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 16

Hello DeskJet Experts!

I just downloaded a printer driver (dvi-jep) for a HP LaserJet.
Because I know that the DeskJet Plus is (almoast) fully compatible
with the LJ, I wanted to use it. But the printout was quite funny!
Internal fonts were used and the characters were overlapping some-
times. After looking at the printout file, I saw that softfonts 
are being downloaded. In my DeskJet Plus printer manual it says
that softfonts can only be used if you have a memory upgrade.
Now, before I spend some money on that I want to be sure that this
would really solve the problem.
Does anybody have a clue?

thanks for any help.

laci

#! rnews 2063
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: gz at pta.oz.au (Electric Blue)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 22:47:18 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:19:36 GMT
Subject: Re: Re^2: Query on HP Hard Drives
Message-ID: <2985 at pta.oz.au>
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Sydney
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpcc05!hp-ptp!hp-ses!hpsdel!sdd.hp.com!samsung!munnari.oz.au!mel.dit.csiro.au!yarra!pta!gz
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.periphs.scsi
References: <18382 at netcom.UUCP>
Followup-to: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 35
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1935 comp.periphs.scsi:965

In article <18382 at netcom.UUCP>, katcher at netcom.UUCP (Jeff Katcher) writes:
> I'd really appeciate it if someone could identify the two HP
> hard disk drives I bought at a sale last week.
> 
> #1 is an HP 97544SF which I am pretty sure is a 396MB (unformatted)
> SCSI drive.
> 
> #2 is an HP 97536F which is a SCSI drive, but I know nothing beyond that.
> The list of HP drives I have, shows a 97530S series, at 136, 204, or 408
> MB, and a 97540S series at 396-793 MB.

		The HP97536 drive is physically 1663 cylinders in size,
	with physical cylinder 776, track 0 reserved for the log track,
	physical cylinders 776 (except for track 0) to 794 used for
	sector sparing, and physical cylinder 795 is the native CE
	cylinder (which is unaccesible to the user). The user data area
	is 1643 cylinders in size. One of the user data cylinders is
	reserved, and another is the user CE cylinder.
		Also note that the disk contains 64, 256-byte sectors
	per track.

		The HP97544 has 1447 cylinders, 8 heads and 14(?) sectors.



Login name: gz    	In real life: George Zisis. Phone +61 2 415 0515 


          				     O.   O   .O
         -m----------			       \.#-#./             
      ----mmm--------                         .'#####`.
   -------mmmmmm-----			     /  |   |  \
----------mmmmmmmmm--         --------------------|--------------------
                      	      Fly Inverted ....   | .... It confuses the hell
							 Out of the ducks....
#! rnews 5521
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rjn at hpfcso.HP.COM (Bob Niland)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 05:50:56 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:17 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Serial LaserJet printing!
Message-ID: <7370267 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard/FSY Ft.Collins,CO,USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!rjn
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpfcso.HP.COM
References: <1990Nov27.111210 at dali.gatech.edu>

re: > I connected an HP laserJet Series II to my HPUX 370 serial port
    > using a cable I built to go from the 370's 9 pin RS-232 to the
    > printer's 25 pin RS-232.
    
Cables to use:

  92221P  direct 9M to 25M, or...
  98561-61604 9M-25F adaptor plus 40242G or 13242G

You need to bring DTR in on CTS to get the hardware flow control.  You also
need to set a bit in the device file minor number to turn on CTS detection
in the host.  Also request the latest serial driver from your HP support
person.  Earlier ones may not do CTS correctly.

The following covers more than just CTS....

re: Advanced Serial Driver                                   Date: 27 Nov 90

Here are the things you can control on the 400 #1 and 345/375 serial port
with the 7.05 or pre-release 7.0/7.03 driver.  Some of this is not yet
documented in any published manuals.  Contact your HP support representative
for a copy of the driver.  Have them contact me if they don't have it.

Permissions    Owner    Group  Major Minor    Last write   File name
crw--w--w-   1 root     crm        1 0x090000 Feb 28 09:39 tty09
crw-rw-rw-   1 root     other      1 0x090001 Nov  4  1988 cua09
crw-rw-rw-   1 root     other      1 0x090001 Feb 12 14:17 cul09
#
# example LP files
#
crw--w--w-   1 root     bin        1 0x0900cc Mar 19 11:44 lp
crw-rw-rw-   1 lp       bin        1 0x0900cc Mar  1  1989 rlp
                                     ^^^^^^^^
                                        |
              __________________________/
             /
             |
             V
  TERMINALS:
        0xScPoAc where
                Sc = card select code (05, 06, 09)
                Po = port number (98642); 00 for other cards
                Ac = access type
        Access type bit fields: AABB CDEF
                AA =   receive fifo trigger level
                        00 =  1
                        01 =  4
                        10 =  8
                        11 = 14  (not on select codes 5 & 6)
 
                BB =   effective tx fifo size
                        00 = 12  (16 on all other buffered cards)
                        01 =  8
                        10 =  4
                        11 =  1
                AA only on 345/375 built-in ports 05, 06, 09, 98628A, 98638A
		   and 98642A
                BB only on 345/375 built-in port 09, 98628A, 98638A and
		   98642A
 
                C = 0  hardware handshake disabled  (CTS/RTS)
                C = 1  hardware handshake enabled
                       CTS available on all built-in 05, 06, 09, 98626A,
		           98628A, 98638A and 98642A port 0
                       RTS available on 345/375/400 built-in 09
 
                D = 0  modem (or modem eliminator)
                D = 1  direct connect
                       Not supported on 98642A ports 1,2,3
 
                E = 0  US modems
                E = 1  CCITT mode (for European modem support)
                       Not supported on 98642A ports 1,2,3
 
                F = 0  call-in port
                F = 1  call-out port (for cu* devices)
 

In addition, UNIX (HP-UX) routinely allows control of the following items.
See the termio(7) manual page in the HP-UX Reference Manual for details.

speed 19200 baud; line = 0; susp <undef>; dsusp <undef>
intr = ^C; quit = ^\; erase = ^H; kill = ^U; swtch = ^@
eof = ^D; eol = ^@; min = 4; time = 0; stop = ^S; start = ^Q
-parenb -parodd cs8 -cstopb -hupcl cread clocal -loblk -crts 
-ignbrk brkint ignpar -parmrk -inpck -istrip -inlcr -igncr icrnl -iuclc 
ixon ixany -ixoff -ienqak 
isig icanon iexten -xcase echo echoe echok -echonl -noflsh 
opost -olcuc onlcr -ocrnl -onocr -onlret -ofill -ofdel -tostop 

Note "ienqak" is ignored on the 300 and 800.


# example /etc/inittab entries (don't use both on the same port)
#
09:2:respawn:/etc/getty -h tty09 HST
09:2:respawn:/etc/getty -h lp LPH    {if using CTS flow control}
09:2:respawn:/etc/getty -h lp LP     {if not}


# example customized /etc/gettydef entries
# The "LP" and "LPH" entry keeps the port properly configure for unspooled I/O.
#
LP# B19200 SANE CS8 ONLCR CLOCAL IXON IXANY TAB3 OPOST ###LP
LPH# B19200 SANE CS8 ONLCR CLOCAL TAB3 OPOST ###LPH
HST# B19200 SANE HUPCL CS8 ISTRIP IXON IXOFF # B19200 SANE HUPCL CS8 ISTRIP IXON IXOFF #HST login: #HST

# example /usr/lib/uucp/Devices entries (HST modem)
#
<type> <cul> <cua> <speed> PROG/usr/lib/dialit <type> /dev/<cul> \T \S \P
Direct tty09 0 19200 direct
Direct cul09 0 19200 direct
ACUHP92205A cul09 cua09 19200 hp92205A

Regards,                                              Hewlett-Packard
Bob Niland                                            3404 East Harmony Road
Internet: rjn at hpfcrjn.FC.HP.COM                       Fort Collins
UUCP: [hplabs|hpu*!hpfcse]!hpfcrjn!rjn                CO          80525-9599

This response does not represent the official position of, or statement by,
the Hewlett-Packard Company.  The above data is provided for informational
purposes only.  It is supplied without warranty of any kind.
#! rnews 1055
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: wehr at fmeed1.UUCP (Bruce Wehr)
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 1990 12:48:40 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:33 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: how to get longer file names?
Message-ID: <8983 at fmeed1.UUCP>
Organization: Ford Electronics Division, Dearborn MI
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!rphroy!teemc!fmeed1!wehr
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec6.123154 at dali.gatech.edu>
Keywords: file names longer help
Lines: 12

In article <1990Dec6.123154 at dali.gatech.edu>, mike at penguin.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay) writes:
> 
> 	I don't suppose that there is any way to allow my file
> names to be longer that 14 characters, is there?

Check out convertfs(1M).

-- 
	       Bruce Wehr (wehr%dptc.decnet at srlvx0.srl.ford.com)
 (...uunet!mailrus!sharkey!fmeed1!wehr) (wehr%fmeed1.uucp at mailgw.cc.umich.edu)
	      Ford Motor Company - Engineering Technology Services
     P.O. Box 2053, Room 1153, Dearborn, Michigan 48121-2053 (313)337-5304
#! rnews 9176
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 16:19:08 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:33 GMT
Subject: Re: Questions about HPUX 8.0, X11R4, HP policy
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.111908 at dali.gatech.edu>
Organization: Georgia Tech
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!ncar!gatech!prism!dali.gatech.edu!mikeg
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec13.100152 at dali.gatech.edu> <101950170 at hpcvlx.cv.hp.com>
Sender: news at prism.gatech.EDU
Reply-To: mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Keywords: get real
Lines: 229


John Milburn replies to my original article:
}The only reason you don't have support is because you
}choose not to.

WRONG.  The "only" reason I do not have support is that I do not run GTRI, that
support is considered unaffordable, and in the past, we have not had good
experience with HP computers.  (We have great expereience with other
hardware HP
makes, like their 8510 network analyzer, I must say.)
 
}If you really want a full X implementation, get the MIT
}distribution and compile it yourself.

As I posted, I do not have the disk space for doing that, since there
can be NO
down time for X on this, I need a running copy of R3 to run while I have
the R4
source, object files, libraries and binaries.  That's quite a bit more
than I
can fit.

---------------------------------------------
Harry Phinney writes:
}	previously announced in this group 
}Not all local HP representatives have the time to keep up on
news/notes
}(apparently some posters don't either).

Some of the posters have not read this group and all of its messages
since the
beginning of time.  I have only had this box for one quarter.

As for "Not all local HP reps..." having time to keep up with news, my
reps
don't have InterNet access, much less news from this group.

} This server is available from:
}hpcvaaz.cv.hp.com (15.255.72.15) in the file:
}If you need some of the libraries not distributed with HP-UX, you can
get
}These contain both libXaw and libXmu.  Get the README file in that
}same directory for information on unpacking these archives.

I have asked some times before, and got no reply, cincerning the Athena
Widgets.  My local rep told me that they were simply not available for
HP.
Naturally she's wrong, since at the very most inconvenient, one can make
X from
the MIT distribution, which (as an HP person points out) is not an
optimal
solution by any means.

In fact, the main two reasons (in order) for me wanting to use R4 is an
strong
need for the GKS libraries, and generally R4 runs things that R3 does
not that
I want to run.

}While new versions do indeed contain bug fixes, they also generally
}contain significant new functionality.  Do you believe it is free for
us
}to continue to improve and enhance our products?  You may not care
}whether I get paid, but I do.  My salary comes from customers who
}purchase our products.  If we simply give away all future work, where
}will my salary come from?

As I posted, there is no such thing as new functionality as far as UNIX
is
concerned.  Translated from HPese, this means "bug fixes," and "putting
in
standard UNIX libraries that HPUX lacked."

Don't get sappy about your pay.  Obviously GTRI does purchase HP
products.  If
we don't buy the "software support," you'll still get paid.  Whether HP
pays
you to do a complete, running version of UNIX, or an incomplete, buggy
version
of some weird hybrid of two flavors of UNIX is my concern.  I'd rather
you get
payed for a good job.  If HP tells you that incomplete, and bugs, are
okay,
then you can't help it.  Fine.  That's between HP and their customers,
not you
and their customers.  Do not tell me that I or any set of customers is
responsible for your pay.  Whether that is true or not is irrelevant to
this
discussion.  However, if you want to take up the matter of your pay with
me,
then I will take up the matter of a lousy job of programming with you.
I'd rather keep this impersonal, and give the programmers the benefit
of
the doubt, and hope that no self respecting systems programmer would
give
their blessing to what is running on my machine right now. I'd rather 
like to think that HP said that "this is good enough for government
work,"
and not give the programmers a part in the decision to market this OS.
If you want to tell me that you condone HPUX 7.0, and that you think
it is acceptable, then I see no problem with it being free, and you not
getting payed.  I suggest you drop this line of reasoning, and leave
further
comments about your pay out of this.

]	X is in the public domain.

}No, X is not in the public domain.  The code from the MIT X Consortium
}is copyrighted by a host of people and corporations, including HP.

What's your point? GNU software is also copyrighted.  I call it PD.  If
there is some legal technicality of words here, then maybe PD is not the
term.
I mean free, legal to distribute, use etc.  I mean that I don't have to
pay for it.  If that is what PD means, then X is in the public domain.

] HP makes so called `inhancements'

}I don't think we've ever claimed to make any "inhancements":-)

That's that the local representative called them.

}We have
}certainly made enhancements to the X server to allow our Starbase,
GKS,
}and PHIGS libraries to better operate within the X environment, and to

GKS and PHIGS work?  Those are what I'm looking for.  That's the reason
I want
R4 (other reasons less important.)  I want to avoid implementing GKS,
and R4 has
it.  If HP has it the I'm happy for Christmas.  Now, where is my
present?
Where do I get a working copy of GKS for my HP?

}take advantage of some of the features of our particular graphics
}systems.  We have also added input extensions to allow the server to
}deal with multiple and varied input devices, and have donated this
input
}code back to the MIT X Consortium.  Please understand that we
}participate in the MIT X releases precisely because we know that some
}customers require the latest-greatest version of X more quickly than
we
}can "productize" it.  These customers (quite possibly including
}yourself) are more than welcome to use the code distributed by MIT,
but
}must realize that it will lack some of the above-mentioned
enhancements
}and has not undergone the same level of testing as our product
releases.

I don't care if it's supported.

}While ranting and flaming may make one feel a bit better during
moments
}of frustration, it doesn't help motivate anyone else to provide
}assistance.

I know.  Money helps motivate anyone to provide assistance.

-----------------------------------
Jim B. Byers replies:
}The MIT tape contains a huge mix of MIT blessed/authored "core"
}programs, and a large bunch of contributed programs that are in
}various states of quality and reliability.  Which ones are of interest
}to you?

Athena Widgets, GKS, and PHIGS are of interest to me.  Are those
considered by
HP to be unreliable, and low quality

} If they all are, have you considered installing the MIT tape
}itself?  Which one would you expect us to answer questions on if
}they were provided?  Which ones would you expect us to bugfix if
}you were on support services and found a problem?

If I were on support, I would expect support for Athena Widgets, GKS and
PHIGS.

}My 2 cents is that I see considerable effort going into new
}functionality.  I expect that I will pay to upgrade to new versions
}of any software I use be it Unix, Dos or whatever.  Nothing is free.

Wrong.  GNU, and X are free to be used by us.

}If all future releases were free then it would cost more upfront [sic].
This
}would be unfair to those who buy a product and rarely upgrade.

It is unfair to pay any money for a UNIX port and have it not work.  If
some
people do not need UNIX to work, then they get a bargain out of
"software
support," because they do not need it.  I use much of what would be UNIX
if
HPUX implemented it.

}We worked quite hard to assure that 
}the MIT stuff will compile up correctly on our machines.
} We also went to
}great effort to provide screen drivers so that one could compile the
}MIT server and still get good performance.  the MIT stuff will compile
up
}correctly on our machines.

As it should be, since you advertise that these boxes run X.

}Where have you found or X11 to be incompatible? Compatibility with
}the standard release is religion here.  We certainly add things that 
}people have said they needed (devices other than a mouse and
keyboard),
}the sox11 driver, Access to the 3D accelerators - but were have we
}lost compatibility?

Oh, that's an easy one.  There are plenty of public domain programs that
expect
Athena Widgets that do not compile.  I even had one program that used
Motif
widgets (one of the few I've found) that tried to use some Motif Widgets
that
were not on my machine, which is supposed to have it.

As far as UNIX programs, I won't even bother telling you much more than
that
is a very, very uninformed, naive question, and a ridiculous claim.

I agree thoroughly with Brian Bartholome's comments in his reply in
this
thread.
#! rnews 2828
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: burzio at mmlai.UUCP (Tony Burzio)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 16:05:27 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:34 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <54 at gauss.mmlai.UUCP>
Organization: Martin Marietta Labs, Baltimore
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!mmlai!burzio
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: Rolls Royce, but poor marketing...
Lines: 45

>I've posted this so amny other places, I might as well post it here
>too.  We have $150,000 to spend on hardware for a computer
>graphics visualization system.  Currently, we have an Apollo netwrok
>with about 25 nodes.  We're looking to do animation of finite
>element analysis results and CFD stuff.  Obviously, at this
>dollar level we'll get a lot of CPU speed.
>
>What would you buy? HP, Apollo, SGI, SUN, STARDENT?  How would
>you configure your dream system.

Why, HP or course!  Regardless of the abysmal marketing ploys by
HP (i.e. none :-), the 835 TurboVRX is a real corker!  Running
SDRC IDEAS in X Window System mode, you should have your socks
blown off!  Nice animations too, and they are VERY fast.  If you
can wait, the "snake" replacement for the 800 series, around the
spring(ish), should give you alarming speed (50+ MIPS?)!
If you really want mucho bang-for-the-buck, get a 400 TurboVRX.
As fast as a Sparc (until the $2K 68040 upgrade arrives, then
twice as fast) but more capable because most of the processing
of graphics is offloaded to the TurboVRX.

Some notes on the 835:  This processor is rated around 12 HP MIPS,
or 15 the way Sun counts them.  The difference between a Sparc and
the 835 is multi-user access (or one user doing two things, like
the 37 processes that SDRC spawns off while X is running :-)
The Sparc will die at process two, because of hardware limitations
(see old .arch postings for details), while the 835 will chug along
unhindered while around 8 CPU burdened jobs are running.

Another marketing secret at HP is the stability of HP-UX, HPs' UNIX
variant.  Very easy to use, and it works great (as long as you use Suns' 
manuals to figure out UUCP :-)  The local HP support (at least for
the moment, the recession may change things) is SUPERB!!!!

Buy from HPs' remarketing or demo sales.  You usually get 50% off
on currently produced systems.  A computer that has run for a
while is much more reliable than a "new" one.  We got 2 GB of disk
for the price of one.  All our "used" parts are under contract and
are still running after three years.

*********************************************************************
Tony Burzio               * Time to SKI!!!
Martin Marietta Labs      *
mmlab!burzio at uunet.uu.net *
*********************************************************************
#! rnews 4909
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bb at reef.cis.ufl.edu (Brian Bartholomew)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 03:35:47 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:56 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <25849 at uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU>
Organization: UF CIS Dept.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!caen!uflorida!reef.cis.ufl.edu!bb
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <54 at gauss.mmlai.UUCP>
Sender: news at uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU
Keywords: Rolls Royce, but poor marketing...
Lines: 92


In article <54 at gauss.mmlai.UUCP> you write:

> I've posted this so amny other places, I might as well post it here
> too.  We have $150,000 to spend on hardware for a computer graphics
> visualization system.  Currently, we have an Apollo netwrok with about
> 25 nodes.  We're looking to do animation of finite element analysis
> results and CFD stuff.  Obviously, at this dollar level we'll get a lot
> of CPU speed.

> What would you buy? HP, Apollo, SGI, SUN, STARDENT?  How would you
> configure your dream system.


Usually I agree with what Tony says, but in this case I almost
completely disagree.  Here's why:

The *first* rule of computer purchasing is to select the software you
want to run, then find a computer that runs it.  Fast hardware is
useless without powerful and flexible software to use it.  *Useless*!

For a start, compare the size of Sun's SPARCware catalog (about 1200
pages, three applications per page) with HP's equivalent software
catalog.  If you can find a close enough match and are happy with the
HP selections, fine.  Just remember that you are choosing from a
substantially smaller pool of applications than you would with Sun.

[Tony paraphrased: The HP 800 series with graphics accelleration is
the fastest machine this week]

Let's see SPECmarks, not MIPS!  What do MIPS mean when comparing
between RISC (SPARC) and CISC (800?) architectures?  Let's see
performance comparisons between equally-priced Sun and HP
configurations.

[Tony paraphrased: The 835 deals better with multiple CPU-intensive
users on the same machine]

I have no data to indicate if this is true or not, and in fact sounds
like a tuning problem (i.e. don't run an animation machine on 8 megs
of RAM).  Assuming that it is real, is this capability useful, given
that this guy needs a head for each seat, to display animation on?

> Another marketing secret at HP is the stability of HP-UX, HPs' UNIX
> variant.  Very easy to use, and it works great (as long as you use
> Suns' manuals to figure out UUCP :-)  The local HP support (at least
> for the moment, the recession may change things) is SUPERB!!!!

As long-time readers of this group know, this is one of my favorite
complaints about HP workstations.  HP-UX is consistantly behind SunOS
in terms of features, most notably networking features.

Within the first week of getting our new HP 9000/345 workstations with
the pre-installed software (including X Release 2 - yum-yum), we had
managed to crash or hang 3 of the 7 machines, at least once.  At the
time, we were taking particular care not to do anything unreasonable
on them, as we didn't have backups of the disk (and the OS tapes
failed upon installation).

I don't know about Tony's area, but at the University of Florida (the
premier Florida Engineering University, perhaps one of the big 3 or 4
in the Southeast) the HP reps are incredibly uninformed about the
workstation product line.  It is extremely difficult to impossible to
get such things as patch tapes out of our sales reps.  The
telephone-based tech support is much better, but usually we have
questions that go over their heads.  And,they keep referring us to the
local reps for patch tapes (!)  The local Sun reps are rather more
clued-in, but perhaps not overwhelmingly so.  However, the existance
of Sun-manager mailing lists, informal ftp sites for patches, and
other such net resources makes expert support just 8 hours and a mail
message away.  I know that HP is attempting to start participating in
this milieu, but they are very far from there yet.

Besides, it seems that a very large percentage of the software posted
on the net has been developed on Sun 3 or 4 computers.  That saves an
awful lot of porting time when that hot new piece of free data-
visualization software comes NNTP'ing down the net.  Examples: KHOROS
(~100 Megs of source), NCSA-something.

[Tony paraphrased: buy cheap, slightly used or demo]

I agree, as long as you get the warranty, like he suggests.

One last note: anyone who cares to dispute these points should attack
my facts, not my attitude.


--
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian Bartholomew	UUCP:       ...gatech!uflorida!mathlab.math.ufl.edu!bb
University of Florida	Internet:   bb at math.ufl.edu
#! rnews 2230
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bb at sandbar.cis.ufl.edu (Brian Bartholomew)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 1990 06:39:11 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:15:55 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <25876 at uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU>
Organization: UF CIS Dept.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!uflorida!sandbar.cis.ufl.edu!bb
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <54 at gauss.mmlai.UUCP> <25849 at uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU> <1990Dec11.193127.23709 at actrix.gen.nz>
Sender: news at uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU
Keywords: Rolls Royce, but poor marketing...
Lines: 41


jlol at REMUS.EE.BYU.EDU (Jay Lawlor) & paul at actrix.gen.nz (Paul Gillingwater)

> The Series 800 is based on HP-PA, which is RISC.  The series 300 and
> 400 are 680x0, which is CISC.

Oops.  Foot-in-newsfeed syndrome.  The comparison I drew was between
Sun 4 (RISC) and 800 (RISC, I now learn).  I still want to see
SPECmarks between equally-priced systems.


jlol at REMUS.EE.BYU.EDU (Jay Lawlor)

> HP's getting better in this area.  You can't catch up all at once.
> Otherwise you'd have bug distribution lists the size of Sun's lists.

I have heard reports that HP is funding some academic institution in
Utah to port true BSD to the 400 line.  Jay, could this perhaps be
your institution?  If so, are you able (legally and properly) to make
a progress report to this newsgroup?

> Well, we have R3 and are running an R4 server from HP that works
> great.

All of our (CIS, Math) Suns are completely running R4.  This would be
an empty point save that I am told the R3->R4 upgrade mainly consisted
of bug fixes.  The (non-)reliability of R2 on the 345's seems to
suggest that as well.

> I guess it depends on where you live.  The ee dept here won't buy any
> more Suns because of the "quality" of support they received.  Our HP
> support has been much better.

Uh, what was your rep's name again?  :-)


--
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian Bartholomew	UUCP:       ...gatech!uflorida!mathlab.math.ufl.edu!bb
University of Florida	Internet:   bb at math.ufl.edu
#! rnews 1942
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mjs at hpfcso.HP.COM (Marc Sabatella)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 1990 17:49:33 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:18:16 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <7370270 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!mjs
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpfcso.HP.COM
References: <54 at gauss.mmlai.UUCP>

Another "fact" that needs clarification is the inferrence that somehow SPEC
numbers are more "meaningful" than MIPS numbers when comparing RISC vs. CISC.
This would be true only if MIPS really did mean "Millions of Instructions Per
Second".  However, no one actually calculates MIPS ratings that way any more.
They are calculated *exactly* the same way as SPEC numbers are - ie, you run
a few benchmarks, divide by the time the same benchmarks take on a VAX, and
produce some sort of average.  RISC/CISC is entirely orthogonal to this.

SPEC ratings differ from MIPS rating in three important respects.  The MIPS
benchmarks are almost entirely integer, almost entirely C, and almost entirely
"toys" (ie, Dhrystone).  The SPEC suite is more floating point intensive and
uses a lot of Fortran, and includes more "real" applications.  Neither suite
tells you much about overall system performance - except for gcc in SPEC, none
do much I/O, or use much VM; none attempt any graphics, networking, etc.

In theory, because of the way the numbers are generated, SPECmarks would always
equal MIPS ratings.  This is almost never true in practice, though - MIPS
numbers are artificially inflated because several of the benchmarks in the
suite are unrealistic "meatballs" for an optimizer to speed up.

--------------
Marc Sabatella (marc at hpmonk.fc.hp.com)
Disclaimers:
	2 + 2 = 3, for suitably small values of 2
	Bill and Dave may not always agree with me
#! rnews 2014
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 16:35:43 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:42 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.113543 at dali.gatech.edu>
Organization: Georgia Tech
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!apple!ames!ncar!gatech!prism!dali.gatech.edu!mikeg
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec14.095519.14818 at hellgate.utah.edu> <BB.90Dec15033453 at beach.cis.ufl.edu>
Sender: news at prism.gatech.EDU
Reply-To: mikeg at dali.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Keywords: silly silly silly stupid
Lines: 34

In article <BB.90Dec15033453 at beach.cis.ufl.edu>, bb at beach.cis.ufl.edu
(Brian Bartholomew) writes:

|> In article <1990Dec14.095519.14818 at hellgate.utah.edu>
|> mjb%hoosier.utah.edu at cs.utah.edu (Mark Bradakis) writes:
|> 
|> > We have a student lab with 40 machines in it.  Half are HP 400t
|> > machines and half are Suns, a mix of Sparcstation 1 and SLCs or
some
|> > such.  Usually when I go over there and the lab is only half used,
|> > nearly all the students are sitting in front of the Hewlett
Packard
|> > machines, only one or two are using Suns.  Remember that TV
commercial
|> > where the two people are asking "Which is the best computer?"  It
is
|> > indeed the one that people use.
|> 
|> Here are some easy questions to ask, that might clarify the
situation:
|> 
|> Are the HP's color and the Sun's mono (SLC's are)?
|> Is there software used locally that only runs on the HP's?
|> Is the local support and system defaults concentrated on the HP's?

Some more such questions:

Does speed not matter?  The Sparcs are much (10x?) faster.
Are the HP's the only machines with local drives? If the Suns are using
	remote-mounted drives (diskless Suns), then they'll seem slower.
Do you do anything with multi-threaded processing?
Do you use/program UNIX as part of the projects that use the machines?
Do the students program X?
Do they use X?
#! rnews 927
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: chan at hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Chan Benson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 21:54:18 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:20:14 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <1080179 at hpfcmgw.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, CO
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!chan
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.7.5 (840 Contrib) 87/2/5; site hpfcmgw.HP.COM
References: <1990Dec14.095519.14818 at hellgate.utah.edu>

> Does speed not matter?  The Sparcs are much (10x?) faster.

I'm willing to admit some advantages to Sun, but the Sparcstation I is
about the same performance as the 400t.  At the worst the multiplier is
some number greater than one and less than two.  It's certainly nowhere
near ten.

			-- Chan

If all the false statistics presented on usenet in a year were placed
end to end they would circle the equator 50,000 times.

#! rnews 1296
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: chan at hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Chan Benson)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:36:36 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:20:46 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Dream System (sort of)
Message-ID: <17780001 at hpfcmgw.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, CO
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!chan
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.7.5 (840 Contrib) 87/2/5; site hpfcmgw.HP.COM
References: <1990Dec14.095519.14818 at hellgate.utah.edu>

Previously, I posted this and then tried to delete too late...

>> Does speed not matter?  The Sparcs are much (10x?) faster.
>
>I'm willing to admit some advantages to Sun, but the Sparcstation I is
>about the same performance as the 400t.  At the worst the multiplier is
>some number greater than one and less than two.  It's certainly nowhere
>near ten.
>
>			-- Chan
>
>If all the false statistics presented on usenet in a year were placed
>end to end they would circle the equator 50,000 times.

OOOOOOOOOPSSSSSSSSSSSS!

And I'm doing my part to make that happen. I should have qualified
my performance statement with the word "integer". The SparcStation I
is 3 to 4 times faster than the 400t on floating point benchmarks.

The 68040 upgrade will pretty much close that gap.

			-- Chan

#! rnews 1246
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: paulp at hpfcdc.HP.COM (Paul Perlmutter)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 14:52:47 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:15:24 GMT
Subject: Re: Strange (??) behaviour of DAT drive
Message-ID: <5570552 at hpfcdc.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, Co.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hpfcdc!paulp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.3  1990/04/18; site hpfcdc.HP.COM
References: <4522 at ruuinf.cs.ruu.nl>


> I ... unload the tape from my workstation ... by issueing the command:

	# mt -t /dev/rmt/0m offl

The unit ejects the tape. ... However, everytime I do this,
I get this message in "/usr/adm/messages" via "dmegs -":

	SCSI: Status bytes: 70 0 2 0 0 0 0 b 0 0 0 0 3a 0 0 0 1 0 0
	SCSI (dev 0xd0500) sense key: Not_ready
	Load operation requested
	sense_code: Medium not present
	SCSI: CCL error: 1 status

This is a bug in the 7.0 DAT driver.  It can be safely ignored.

The reason?  After the tape is successfully ejected, the driver during 
the tape "close" routine will issue a reposition command to the 
non-cartridge and the request fails.   Other than the spurious error
message, no other action occurs, thus you can forget the message.

#! rnews 2138
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: louxj at jacobs.CS.ORST.EDU (John W. Loux)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 17:37:29 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:32 GMT
Subject: Re: HELP from HP 48sx and 28s users
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.173729.18396 at usenet@scion.CS.ORST.EDU>
Organization: Solve and Integrate - Dept.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!rutgers!orstcs!usenet!jacobs.CS.ORST.EDU!louxj
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <562 at shum.UUCP>
Sender: @usenet at scion.CS.ORST.EDU
Lines: 40
Nntp-Posting-Host: jacobs.cs.orst.edu

In article <562 at shum.UUCP> dmtg at vms.huji.ac.il writes:
>
>     HELLO there
> I seek programs solving algebric arrays (arrays including vars)
>giving output in algebric form .In return I developed few multygrid solving
>programs if anyone in need.
>                                           THANKS DAVID

Hi,

First of all, the UseNet group that deals with the 48SX and 28S is
comp.sys.handhelds.  You will find much more discussion about these
calculators there.  There have even been a couple of ``symbollic matrix''
programs posted.

Other than that, there is the HP BBS (503-750-4448) available to Internet
people via telnet at hpcvbbs.cv.hp.com.  You can also FTP anonymousely to that
address, but only the more popular code files from the BBS are posted there.

Finally, if all goes well, Solve and Integrate (my company) will shortly be
distributing disk copies of the BBS information.

If all else fails, send me email, I have archived several (both?) of the
symbollic array programs.

As to your software, there is almost never a quastion of anyone wanting
software that someone else has developed.  Most often it is ``how do I get
it?''  In other words, yes please post your programs to comp.sys.handhelds
and/or the HP BBS.  From either place your software contribution will be
distributed to other archive sites and BBSes so that anyone who wants/needs
what you have developed can easily get to it.

Hope I've helped.


John W. Loux
Solve and Integrate Corp.
orstcs.cs.orst.edu!solvint!john
jacobs.cs.orst.edu!louxj
john at solvint.UUCP
#! rnews 1606
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: hm at hcshh.UUCP (Hellmuth Michaelis)
Date: Sat, 8 Dec 1990 14:18:59 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:33 GMT
Subject: Recovery of a 9000/800 system after a disk-crash
Message-ID: <353 at hcshh.UUCP>
Organization: HCS GmbH, Hamburg, Europe
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!samsung!uunet!mcsun!unido!hcshh!hm
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: recovery, disk-crash, mkrs
Lines: 22

A week ago we had a disk-crash on our 9000/825. We were in the lucky
situation of having just made a fullbackup using fbackup, but when trying
to restore the system, i recognized the missing of a minimal HP-UX like
the one we made on our 300-system with the 'mkrs'-script.

On the HP-PA support tape the frestore was missing, so we completly re-
installed the operating system until we were able to use frestore to 
restore our backup-tapes. 

Then we read through all the documentation of the 800, but we did'nt
found any hints like the one provided with the 300 ("Disaster Recovery").

So, 1. is there an easier method after such a crash to restore my backups
and 2. where can i find information/documentation on this subject. 

Any pointers are very welcome !

Thanks, Hellmuth
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hellmuth Michaelis   HCS Hanseatischer Computerservice GmbH    Hamburg, Europe
uucp: hm at hcshh.UUCP (..!mcsun!unido!hcshh!hm)            phone: +49 40 5501075
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#! rnews 1114
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: stoler at seas.gwu.edu (Rich Stoler)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 17:19:12 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:36 GMT
Subject: Software Help
Message-ID: <2434 at sparko.gwu.edu>
Organization: The George Washington University, Washington D.C.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!seas.gwu.edu!!stoler
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,alt.sys.sun
Sender: news at seas.gwu.edu
Reply-To: stoler at seas.gwu.edu (Rich Stoler)
Followup-to: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 12
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1901 alt.sys.sun:1462

This doesn't appear to have gotten out but sorry if it is a repeat.

I am looking for a piece of software called grap which takes plot data and
translates it into a format known to/useable by troff.  If anyone has said
software on a sun or an hp workstation/server can he please let me know?  

Thanks.
--
             Rich Stoler, Senior Systems Prgrammer,
	       	  George Washington University
     SEAS Computing Facility, 725 23rd St NW, Washington DC 20052
 	     stoler at seas.gwu.edu  -or-  uunet!gwusun!stoler
#! rnews 1160
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mike%jaguar.utah.edu at cs.utah.edu (Mike Hibler)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 17:26:19 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:38 GMT
Subject: A1401A DIO-II to DIO adapters for 400s
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.102619.6775 at hellgate.utah.edu>
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!cs.utexas.edu!hellgate.utah.edu!jaguar.utah.edu!mike
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: usa
Lines: 19

Anybody know anything about these pups?  I just tried one in a 400s with a
selection of DIO cards:

98642A 4-port MUX	works
98625B HP-IB		ROM identifies and then "UNEXPECTED USE OF FFFFFFAC"
98658A SCSI		ROM identifies and then hangs

I get a Really Bad Feeling from this, it sounds like devices which do DMA
don't work.  The most comprehensive documentation I have seen on these
adapters is from a price quotation and says:

	"Converts DIO-II interface in Model 400s to DIO.
	Includes all hardware and instructions."

No documentation was included with any of the 6 adapters we received.

	Mike Hibler
	mike at cs.utah.edu
	...!utah-cs!mike
#! rnews 1085
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: sandin at uicbert.eecs.uic.edu (Dan Sandin)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 22:16:35 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:45 GMT
Subject: HP 9000/835 to HP PaintJet XL Driver
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.221635.3440 at uicbert.eecs.uic.edu>
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!news.cs.indiana.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uicbert.eecs.uic.edu!sandin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: paintjet srx driver
Lines: 11
Summary: Need paintjet driver

HP Just gave us a paintjet XL, the kind with the HPIB interface, so
our only choice is to hook it up to our HP 9000/835. That's just
fine by me, 'cos that particular workstation is de facto mine. One
more toy for me to play with. But, since it was a gift, and got
lost for 6 mo, etc, there is no driver. Our contact at HP is supposed
to be getting us the driver, but if anyone else could FTP it to me,
it would be pretty nice.

adTHANKSvance

stephan meyers c/o sandin at uicbert.eecs.uic.edu
#! rnews 1155
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: kees at ee.ualberta.ca (Kees denHartigh)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 23:48:26 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:49 GMT
Subject: scsi controllers for HP9000-835?
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.234826.7499 at ee.ualberta.ca>
Organization: University of Alberta Electrical Engineering
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!van-bc!ubc-cs!alberta!edson!news
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Distribution: na
Sender: news at ee.ualberta.ca
Reply-To: kees at ee.ualberta.ca (Kees denHartigh)
Lines: 11

I am looking to increase the disk space on my HP9000-835 machines
Presently we employ HPIB controllers to some rather antiquated
Hard Drives. I was hoping to purchase some scsi controllers
(If available for the 835 series) and attach some cheaper scsi
drives to the system. Has anybody got any suggestions?
Do's and dont's?
-- 
Kees denHartigh                         kees at ee.ualberta.ca 
Electrical Engineering Digital Labs     alberta!bode!kees
University of Alberta 238 Civil Elect   Voice (403)492-5421
Edmonton, Alberta Canada                Fax   (403)492-1811
#! rnews 1308
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rocky at polyof.poly.edu (A1 rocky shiotsuki (staff) )
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 18:47:01 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:52 GMT
Subject: Help, cc said "Symbol table overflow"
Message-ID: <1990Dec9.184701.22354 at polyof.poly.edu>
Organization: Polytechnic University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!cs.utexas.edu!yale!cmcl2!polyof!rocky
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 26


  Hi netpeople,

  Please advice me for my problem.
  I try to compile a C source code on HP 9000 series 400
as followed:

        cc -c -g TtyText.c
then the compiler gave a error message that
   Symbol table overflow. Try the -Wc,-Ns option.

Ok, I try again with option
        cc -c -g -Wc,-Ns TtyText.c
the compiler stil gave me a error that
   , line 0: warning: Table size specified too small (ignored)
   Symbol table overflow. Try the -Wc,-Ns option.

  I'm new to unix system, I never see this error message before on
anyother unix system. How can I bigger symbol table?

  Thanks in advance...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rocky Shiotsuki				Internet: rocky at puscs.poly.edu
Systems Programmer					128.238.5.8
Polytechnic University
333 Jay Street, Brooklyn, New York 11201
#! rnews 947
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: gates at hpfcdc.HP.COM (Bill Gates)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 1990 19:22:03 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:15:56 GMT
Subject: Re: Help, cc said "Symbol table overflow"
Message-ID: <5570549 at hpfcdc.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, Co.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hpfcdc!gates
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.3  1990/04/18; site hpfcdc.HP.COM
References: <1990Dec9.184701.22354 at polyof.poly.edu>

>   Symbol table overflow. Try the -Wc,-Ns option.

If you check out the cc(1) man page in the HP-UX reference, you'll see that
-N is the global option you need, "s" is the sub-option stating which table
is to be re-sized, and a following number is the desired number of entries.
The default number of entries in the symbol table is 2000.  You can increase
its size with something like:

    -Wc,-Ns4000

Hope this helps,

Bill Gates
#! rnews 1061
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: robs at hpuamsa.neth.hp.com (Rob Slotemaker CRC)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 1990 07:51:36 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 01:18:14 GMT
Subject: Re: Help, cc said "Symbol table overflow"
Message-ID: <28510009 at hpuamsa.neth.hp.com>
Organization: HP-Sales Office-The Netherlands
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpcc05!hpgva1!hpuamsa!robs
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1990Dec9.184701.22354 at polyof.poly.edu>
Lines: 19

You must specify a number, like:

  cc -c -g -Wc,-Ns4000 TtyText.c

See cc(1) for more information. Default values are:

  - a = 10000; Maximum size of the asciz table.
  - b = 100; Maximum size of the bc table.
  - d = 1000; Initial size of the dimtab table.
  - e = 350; Maximum number of nodes per statement.
  - p = 150; Maximum size of the parameter stack.
  - s = 2000; Maximum size of the symbol table.
  - t = 20000; Maximum size of the tasciz table.
  - w = 250; Maximum size of the switch table stack.


Best regards,

Rob Slotemaker, Dutch CRC
#! rnews 1240
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: ewagar at crash.cts.com (Eric Wagar)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 00:30:53 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:56 GMT
Subject: HP Vectra setup program
Message-ID: <6246 at crash.cts.com>
Organization: Crash TimeSharing, El Cajon, CA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!sdd.hp.com!usc!ucselx!crash!ewagar
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: HP Vectra CS, setup.exe, other options
Lines: 17
Summary: How does one get the other options available in setup?

A few months ago in Byte magazine, someone mentioned that if you typed
"yada" at the first menu of the Vectra setup program, another,
"secret" menu is given.  Are there any other such secret menus, that
would enable me to turn the keyclick on (it says you can do this in
the instruction manual).  Using a "filepeek" type program, there are
indeed other choices that are in the program that I can't choose.
Please help!

Either reply via email, or post to the net.  Thanks in advance!
-- 

   Eric Wagar	 	 	ewagar at crash.cts.com | inet
			 ...{nosc,ucsd}!crash!ewagar | uucp
			       crash!ewagar at nosc.mil | arpa
					...or...
			             ewagar at ucsd.edu | inet
				         ucsd!ewagar | uucp
#! rnews 2222
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: keho at quads.uchicago.edu (thomas david kehoe)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 01:24:25 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:56 GMT
Subject: Teaching math with HP calculators
Message-ID: <1990Dec11.012425.7739 at midway.uchicago.edu>
Organization: University of Chicago
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen!boingo.med.jhu.edu!haven!mimsy!midway!quads.uchicago.edu!keho
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,sci.math
Sender: news at midway.uchicago.edu (News Administrator)
Lines: 31
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1910 sci.math:2943

I'm hoping to get a summer job with Hewlett-Packard, and
I'm thinking of writing to them with some ideas for
marketing their 48SX and 28S calculators.  (I'm working
on an MBA at the University of Chicago; the 48SX and 28S
sell for about $300 and $200 respectively, and do calculus,
algebra, graphing, and about 2000 other things.)

The main idea is to develop textbooks for teaching calculus,
college algebra, trig, etc., with the calculators.  I remember
these courses as being long on the mechanics of the chain rule,
Gauss-Jordan elimination, etc., and short on solving word
problems.  With the HP calculators (or computer-based applications),
a course could quickly cover the mechanics and get on to setting
up and solving word problems.  Plus, the graphing functions
would also make the concepts easier to understand.

Could someone tell me whether there are already courses like
this?  Do they work well?  Do instructors like to offer them?
Are they using Macintosh applications, or HP calculators, or
what?  Are there textbooks?

My other idea was just to sell a funny poster about calculus
in college bookstores.  Maybe commission Gary Larsen to do
a "Far Side" about calculus.  (I remember the National Lampoon
poster of a woman on a beach saying "I love men who know
calculus".)  Then the back of the poster would have photos
of the 48SX and 28S, with copy about how they do calculus.
--
"Why my thoughts are my own, when they are in, but when they are out
they are another's." - Susanna Martin, executed for witchcraft, 1681.
Dave Kehoe  keho at midway.uchicago.edu  (312) 753-0119
#! rnews 2843
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: keho at quads.uchicago.edu (thomas david kehoe)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 01:28:57 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:57 GMT
Subject: Teaching math with HP calculators
Message-ID: <1990Dec11.012857.7861 at midway.uchicago.edu>
Organization: University of Chicago
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen!boingo.med.jhu.edu!haven!mimsy!midway!quads.uchicago.edu!keho
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,sci.math
Sender: news at midway.uchicago.edu (News Administrator)
Lines: 45
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1911 sci.math:2944

I'm trying to hustle up a summer job with Hewlett-Packard.
Do you think they'd go for the following ideas for marketing
the HP 48SX and 28S calculators?  (I'm working on a MBA at
the University of Chicago; the 48SX and 28S sell for about
$300 and $200 respectively and do calculus, graphing, algebra,
and about 2000 other things.)

The main idea is to develop textbooks for calculus, college
algrebra, trig, statistics, etc., using the HP 48SX and 28S.
The "slant" would be to spend less time on the mechanics of
the chain rule, Gauss-Jordan elimination, etc., and more
time setting up and solving word problems.  I assume that
people who use calculus in the "real world" use computer
applications or HP calculators instead of doing it by hand.
There would also be use of the graphing functions so that
students could get a picture of what they're doing.

The main point would be that math could be taught better
with computers/calculator applications, but teaching faster
could be another point.  Portland Community College
offers a 2-quarter calculus course with the 28S that replaces
the 3-quarter calculus course.

The 48SX doesn't do statistics as well as Minitab or other
statistics applications, so I won't push this.

Is this a good idea?  Would math instructors want to offer
such courses?  HP's calculator division has a reputation
for producing excellent manuals, so I'm sure the quality of
the textbook would be excellent.  Is HP already doing this?
Have other colleges offered such courses, and how did they work out?

My other idea for marketing the 48SX and 28S is to sell a
funny poster about calculus in college bookstores.
Maybe commision Gary Larsen to do a "Far Side" about 
calculus.  I remember that National Lampoon had a
fairly popular poster of a woman on a beach saying "I love
men who know calculus."  This would be too sexist for the
'90's, but something else could work.  The back of the
poster would have photos of the 48SX and 28S calculators
and copy describing how they do calculus.
--
"Why my thoughts are my own, when they are in, but when they are out
they are another's." - Susanna Martin, executed for witchcraft, 1681.
Dave Kehoe  keho at midway.uchicago.edu  (312) 753-0119
#! rnews 1774
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: walt at bcarh133.uucp (Walt Sullivan)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 12:57:43 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:47 GMT
Subject: Re: HP 9000/345 keyboard mapping
Message-ID: <WALT.90Dec11075743 at bcarh133.uucp>
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Ottawa, Canada
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!cs.utexas.edu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!cunews!bnrgate!bwdls61.bnr.ca!bwdls58!leibniz!walt
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <409 at clbull.cl.bull.fr>
Sender: news at bwdls58.UUCP
Lines: 37
In-reply-to: oun at cl.bull.fr's message of 7 Dec 90 13:26:55 GMT

In article <409 at clbull.cl.bull.fr> oun at cl.bull.fr (Jean-Luc Oun) writes:

      Could some kind soul tell me how to remap the keyboard sequence generated
      by the "Back space" button of a HP 9000/345 keyboard.

      Right now, the "Back space" generates the chareacter "^H". So in emacs 
      18.55, instead of deleting the last char, it just calls the help-for-help
      Emacs-lisp function. and it drives me crazy :-( :-(

For exactly the same reason, I rebound my "Back Space" key to send DEL. I don't
know if this will help you, because my soultion works with X Windows (X11R2). In
mt .login file, I do:

xmodmap .keymap.km

where .keymap.km contains:
!
!	Walt's xmodmap keymap modification file
!
! get rid of the stupid Caps Lock key
remove Lock = Caps_Lock
!
! make the Back space key send me a DEL
keycode 101 = Delete

You'll notice that I disable the Caps Lock key, too. I'm a clumsy typist at the
best of times, and was very tired of trying to hit CTRL-something and ending up
TYPING EVERYTHING ELSE IN CAPS!



--
Walt Sullivan
9D35 Carling
Mail stop 104
ESN 393-7952
Unix mail: walt at bcarh133
#! rnews 2303
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: lindner at cs.umn.edu (Paul Lindner)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 09:30:01 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:49 GMT
Subject: Tips for a new HP admin?
Message-ID: <1990Dec11.093001.25983 at cs.umn.edu>
Organization: University of Minnesota, Minneapolis, CSci dept.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lindner
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: HPUX 400 series
Lines: 35
Summary: Send me useful info please!!

I've been "appointed" to take care of a brand new batch of HP 400 Series.
I've had some experience with HP-UX in the past.  (Specifically a
HP9000/320 with a couple of 310 clients!).  I didn't really do much 
sysadmin stuff on em though.  I've done quite a bit of admin work on
Suns, Nexts, and RS/6000's though, so I'm not completely in the dark.

What I'd like is any information that you think is imperative for the
first time HP admin.  Basically if you've got a nugget of information
that saved you a bunch of time, by all means let me know!  I'm
looking for information in the following areas.  (Hopefully some
of these questions will be answered by the Manual set which hasn't
arrived yet.)

1) Printing appears different.  What does an old lpd hacker have to do?
2) HP NCS, what is this?  NFS support is there, after I reconfigged the
   kernel.  Is NCS better?  I seem to recall that OSF liked it.
3) In the same vein, what about YP, errr NIS.  It's there, I tried it
   but it doesn't seem to work correctly.
4) finger seems broken, "finger lindner at mermaid.micro.umn.edu" doesn't
   want to work.  (My resolv.conf file is correct so it ain't that).
5) Will rdump/rrestore work correctly for a remote Exabyte tape drive?
6) .....

I could go on and on.  I've got the machines here and I'm itching to
get them up and running correctly.  Right now they're in that booted
but not the way I like them state.  Any tips and techniques will be 
greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

-- 
Paul Lindner, Univ. of MN   \ Microcomputer /  Pauls Law: You can't
IT Sun dude, & UofM ACM pres \ Workstation / fall off the floor.
lindner at boombox.micro.umn.edu \ Networks  / {...!rutgers!umn-cs!lindner}
     |   |  |  |  | | | | |||||\ Center  /||||| | | | |  |  |  |   |
#! rnews 976
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: larryc at hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Larry Corsa)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 1990 20:51:27 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:20:14 GMT
Subject: Re: HPGL on the HPLaserjetIII
Message-ID: <560002 at hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Measurement Systems Op., Loveland, CO, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplvec!larryc at hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.2  87/11/24; site hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM
References: <15737.27637b0d at ccvax.ucd.ie>

Sounds like you haven't got the printer in HP-GL/2 mode.  I believe this is 
accomplished by:

     [ESC]%0B


Regards,

Larry Corsa 

Technical Support Engineer     |  HPDesk address: HP0900/UX 
Measurement Systems Operation  |  HPUX address: larryc at hpisla.lvld.hp.com
815 14th Street SW             |  (303) or TELNET 679-2206 
Mail Stop CU312                |  FAX (303) or TELNET 679-5957
Loveland, CO 80537, USA        |
#! rnews 627
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rer at hpfcdc.HP.COM (Rob Robason)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 1990 00:09:43 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:20:15 GMT
Subject: Re: HPGL on the HPLaserjetIII
Message-ID: <5570550 at hpfcdc.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Fort Collins, Co.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hpfcdc!rer
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.3  1990/04/18; site hpfcdc.HP.COM
References: <15737.27637b0d at ccvax.ucd.ie>

You probably need to prepend some escape sequence to the data to get the
printer into plot mode.  That should be documented in the manual.
#! rnews 1808
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mike at penguin.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 16:23:14 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:34 GMT
Subject: Intolerable Mail Problem
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.112314 at dali.gatech.edu>
Organization: Georgia Tech
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ncar!gatech!prism!dali.gatech.edu!mikeg
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at prism.gatech.EDU
Reply-To: mike at penguin.gatech.edu (Mike Gourlay)
Keywords: mail sendmail bug help
Lines: 31

Hi,

	Sometimes when mail comes to me, the file
/usr/mail/mike
will already exist, and have the mode
-rw-r----
which means that the mail group can not write to the file.  What happens
is that the mailer tries to save the message, and can not, so
the mail does not get written.  The worst thing is that the mail
does not bounce;  The mailer thinks everything went smoothly,
and biff tells my that I have new mail.  The message is not there,
and I have no way of finding out what the message was, who sent it,
or anything.  I lose a lot of mail this way.  I've lost at least a dozen
messages,
and who knows how much more when I'm not around to see biff
puke up the eaten message.

	My temporary fix is to delete the badly chmod'ed file,
so that mail can create a new one with -rw-rw---- permissions.
That does not recover my lost mail, and invariably, it happens
again and again eating more mail.

	I know that I've seen some fixes for a couple of HP things,
but I don't recall seeing a fix for this.  I can't imagine that I'm the
only one who has seen this unless I'm doing something weird.

	Is this common?  Is it my fault, or HP's?  How do I fix it?

	Thanks yet again for help with my HP,
	Mike Gourlay
	mike at penguin.gatech.edu
#! rnews 1163
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mike at hpwin052.HP.COM (Mike Croom)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 1990 14:19:02 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:41 GMT
Subject: Re: News from HP-UX 8.0 ?
Message-ID: <4010002 at hpwin052.HP.COM>
Organization: HP AEO - London, England
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!otter.hpl.hp.com!hpltoad!hpopd!hpwin052!mike
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
References: <1196 at aut.autelca.ascom.ch>
Lines: 10

Yes on SCSI, the details are coming through now but not in strength. I guess
your local office will put on a meeting to discuss the new features roundbout
MArch time but I am in no position to vouch for that.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Mike Croom                       This is just my angle on it, not HP's      -
| Financial Services AEO                                                      -
| London UK                        --------------------------------------------
| +44-71-583-6565                  No catchy motto thought of yet             -
| VoiceMail +44-344-367538  --------------------------------------------------- 
#! rnews 2213
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rocky at polyof.poly.edu (A1 rocky shiotsuki (staff) )
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 15:47:24 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:01 GMT
Subject: xtank available for HP 9000 Series 400
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.154724.29966 at polyof.poly.edu>
Organization: Polytechnic University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!cs.utexas.edu!yale!cmcl2!polyof!rocky
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.windows.x,comp.source.x
Lines: 38
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1982 comp.windows.x:8161


    Hi everyone,

    Do you know about xtank?  I'm very new to xtank, so I can't
able to describe a detail, but I try my best.
    It is very impressive true interactive fully graphical
game, or war simulation for Xwindow environment. This program
is developed by Terry Donhue in Oct. 1987. Since then, Terry
and his friends modify and updated it.
    Inside of xtank, there are many new programming technique,
such as running many processes simultaneously, but not using
fork() function, and handle multiple Xservers, display, keyboard
and mouse, simultaneously. You will get know more when you read
a document for xtank.  Right now, xtank's source code size is
about 2.2 Mega bytes, and compressed one is 891561 bytes (after
I modified it).
    Right now, as I know, xtank only works for SUN workstation,
HP 9000 Series 800, APOLLO (I'm not sure), and Amiga.  But I got
chance to work with HP 9000 Series 400, so I modified xtank
spend some time in 4 days (between full time work), some how
it is working partially. So here is unofficial release xtank
for HP9000 Series 400. I sent e-mail and modified version of
xtank to stripes at eng.umd.edu.

xtank available from:
   ftp.eng.umd.edu   xtank1.2f.tar.Z  ; official version, but
				      ; does not work with
				      ; hp9000s400

   puscs.poly.edu    xtank1.2fb.tar.Z ; unofficital version
				      ; for hp9000s400

    I hope we will have special news group for xtank.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rocky Shiotsuki				Internet: rocky at puscs.poly.edu
Systems Programmer					128.238.5.8
Polytechnic University
333 Jay Street, Brooklyn, New York 11201
#! rnews 885
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: award at uafhp.uark.edu (Sven Thjostarsson)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 19:43:20 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:54 GMT
Subject: priv source?
Message-ID: <5712 at uafhp.uark.edu>
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Arkansas, Fayetteville
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!umriscc!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!uafhp!award
Newsgroups: comp.unix.admin,comp.sys.hp
Followup-to: poster
Keywords: sushi stuff
Lines: 5
Xref: hplabs comp.unix.admin:818 comp.sys.hp:1983


I am looking for a more secure way to run shell scripts with root
authority.  I currently have a C program that simply calls the
script via "system()".  I have heard of a program called "priv".
Can anyone point me to where it can be ftp'd or to something else
that will address my needs?
#! rnews 1286
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: tamu at uxh.cso.uiuc.edu
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 15:03:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:56 GMT
Subject: memory,fortran,starbase, again
Message-ID: <19300009 at uxh.cso.uiuc.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uxh.cso.uiuc.edu!tamu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 22
Nf-ID: #N:uxh.cso.uiuc.edu:19300009:000:724
Nf-From: uxh.cso.uiuc.edu!tamu    Dec 17 09:03:00 1990


Dear group,
   Last week I wrote a note about memory limits in fortran.  Well, in
all of my infinite wisdom I left some important facts out.  The first is,
I am using starbase, and the error appears there.  I associatted it with
memory because it only happens when I really push up the common block
usage.  The error that appears is:

   Starbase error 105:  Cannot Start Graphics Resource Manager
             Procedure name:        gopen
                          .
                          .
                          .


  The manuals that I have only LIST starbase errors.  I can't seem to
find any corrective action for the errors.
  Thank you all for your help.

Todd Henderson
UI CFD Lab
hender at uicfdc.aae.uiuc.edu
#! rnews 1026
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: neil at yc.estec.nl (Neil Dixon)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 17:06:40 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:56 GMT
Subject: Full unexec required for Perl on hp800
Message-ID: <1423 at esatst.yc.estec.nl>
Organization: ESTEC/YCV, Noordwijk, The Netherlands
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!uunet!mcsun!hp4nl!esatst!neil
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Reply-To: neil at esatst.UUCP (Neil Dixon)
Keywords: unexec Perl Emacs
Lines: 10

I'd like to get a copy of unexec for the 800 series what will work with Perl.
The version that comes with Emacs doesn't seem to, possibly because the bss data
is never saved.  Anyone know of such a beast,  or have clues on how to add
it to the existing unexec?

-- 
Neil Dixon <neil at yc.estec.nl> UUCP:...!mcvax!esatst!neil, BITNET: NDIXON at ESTEC
Thermal Control & Life Support Division (YC) 
European Space Research and Technology Centre (ESTEC),
Noordwijk, The Netherlands.
#! rnews 840
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: award at uafhp.uark.edu (Sven Thjostarsson)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 22:00:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:56 GMT
Subject: indir and #!
Message-ID: <5713 at uafhp.uark.edu>
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Arkansas, Fayetteville
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!uafhp!award
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Keywords: can I enable it?
Lines: 12


I am trying to install indir on an HP 375.  I have gotten it to compile,
but when I try to execute a script like:

#!/usr/local/bin/indir some list of arguments

My shell reports to me that the file cannot be executed.  Is there
something I need to do to enable this or is it not supported under
HP-UX?

Thanks in advance,

Sven
#! rnews 1207
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: preetham at ra.src.umd.edu (Preetham Gopalaswamy)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 23:00:17 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:57 GMT
Subject: The "getdtablesize" command
Message-ID: <28687 at mimsy.umd.edu>
Organization: UMIACS, Univ. of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!emory!gatech!udel!haven!mimsy!preetham at ra.src.umd.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Sender: news at mimsy.umd.edu
Reply-To: preetham at umiacs.umd.edu (Preetham Gopalaswamy)
Lines: 12


I am trying to compile a software package that was unfortunately not written
for SysV although they claim that it is.   The computer being used is an HP800
running HPUX 3.1.   One of the problems that I am facing is finding a SysV
equivalent for the command "getdtablesize" which is used (so the SUN man
pages say) to "get the descriptor table size".   What can I use instead of
this command since it does not exist on the HPs.
Any help would be appreciated.   Thanks in advance.

							Preetham Gopalaswamy

ps: You may either post the answer or send e-mail to preetham at ra.src.umd.edu

#! rnews 885
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: award at uafhp.uark.edu (Sven Thjostarsson)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 19:43:20 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:54 GMT
Subject: priv source?
Message-ID: <5712 at uafhp.uark.edu>
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Arkansas, Fayetteville
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!umriscc!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!uafhp!award
Newsgroups: comp.unix.admin,comp.sys.hp
Followup-to: poster
Keywords: sushi stuff
Lines: 5
Xref: hplabs comp.unix.admin:818 comp.sys.hp:1983


I am looking for a more secure way to run shell scripts with root
authority.  I currently have a C program that simply calls the
script via "system()".  I have heard of a program called "priv".
Can anyone point me to where it can be ftp'd or to something else
that will address my needs?
#! rnews 2213
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rocky at polyof.poly.edu (A1 rocky shiotsuki (staff) )
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 15:47:24 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:01 GMT
Subject: xtank available for HP 9000 Series 400
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.154724.29966 at polyof.poly.edu>
Organization: Polytechnic University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!cs.utexas.edu!yale!cmcl2!polyof!rocky
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.windows.x,comp.source.x
Lines: 38
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1982 comp.windows.x:8161


    Hi everyone,

    Do you know about xtank?  I'm very new to xtank, so I can't
able to describe a detail, but I try my best.
    It is very impressive true interactive fully graphical
game, or war simulation for Xwindow environment. This program
is developed by Terry Donhue in Oct. 1987. Since then, Terry
and his friends modify and updated it.
    Inside of xtank, there are many new programming technique,
such as running many processes simultaneously, but not using
fork() function, and handle multiple Xservers, display, keyboard
and mouse, simultaneously. You will get know more when you read
a document for xtank.  Right now, xtank's source code size is
about 2.2 Mega bytes, and compressed one is 891561 bytes (after
I modified it).
    Right now, as I know, xtank only works for SUN workstation,
HP 9000 Series 800, APOLLO (I'm not sure), and Amiga.  But I got
chance to work with HP 9000 Series 400, so I modified xtank
spend some time in 4 days (between full time work), some how
it is working partially. So here is unofficial release xtank
for HP9000 Series 400. I sent e-mail and modified version of
xtank to stripes at eng.umd.edu.

xtank available from:
   ftp.eng.umd.edu   xtank1.2f.tar.Z  ; official version, but
				      ; does not work with
				      ; hp9000s400

   puscs.poly.edu    xtank1.2fb.tar.Z ; unofficital version
				      ; for hp9000s400

    I hope we will have special news group for xtank.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rocky Shiotsuki				Internet: rocky at puscs.poly.edu
Systems Programmer					128.238.5.8
Polytechnic University
333 Jay Street, Brooklyn, New York 11201
#! rnews 1114
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: stoler at seas.gwu.edu (Rich Stoler)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 17:19:12 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:36 GMT
Subject: Software Help
Message-ID: <2434 at sparko.gwu.edu>
Organization: The George Washington University, Washington D.C.
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!seas.gwu.edu!!stoler
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,alt.sys.sun
Sender: news at seas.gwu.edu
Reply-To: stoler at seas.gwu.edu (Rich Stoler)
Followup-to: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 12
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1901 alt.sys.sun:1462

This doesn't appear to have gotten out but sorry if it is a repeat.

I am looking for a piece of software called grap which takes plot data and
translates it into a format known to/useable by troff.  If anyone has said
software on a sun or an hp workstation/server can he please let me know?  

Thanks.
--
             Rich Stoler, Senior Systems Prgrammer,
	       	  George Washington University
     SEAS Computing Facility, 725 23rd St NW, Washington DC 20052
 	     stoler at seas.gwu.edu  -or-  uunet!gwusun!stoler

#! rnews 2063
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: gz at pta.oz.au (Electric Blue)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 22:47:18 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:19:36 GMT
Subject: Re: Re^2: Query on HP Hard Drives
Message-ID: <2985 at pta.oz.au>
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Sydney
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpcc05!hp-ptp!hp-ses!hpsdel!sdd.hp.com!samsung!munnari.oz.au!mel.dit.csiro.au!yarra!pta!gz
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.periphs.scsi
References: <18382 at netcom.UUCP>
Followup-to: comp.sys.hp
Lines: 35
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1935 comp.periphs.scsi:965

In article <18382 at netcom.UUCP>, katcher at netcom.UUCP (Jeff Katcher) writes:
> I'd really appeciate it if someone could identify the two HP
> hard disk drives I bought at a sale last week.
> 
> #1 is an HP 97544SF which I am pretty sure is a 396MB (unformatted)
> SCSI drive.
> 
> #2 is an HP 97536F which is a SCSI drive, but I know nothing beyond that.
> The list of HP drives I have, shows a 97530S series, at 136, 204, or 408
> MB, and a 97540S series at 396-793 MB.

		The HP97536 drive is physically 1663 cylinders in size,
	with physical cylinder 776, track 0 reserved for the log track,
	physical cylinders 776 (except for track 0) to 794 used for
	sector sparing, and physical cylinder 795 is the native CE
	cylinder (which is unaccesible to the user). The user data area
	is 1643 cylinders in size. One of the user data cylinders is
	reserved, and another is the user CE cylinder.
		Also note that the disk contains 64, 256-byte sectors
	per track.

		The HP97544 has 1447 cylinders, 8 heads and 14(?) sectors.



Login name: gz    	In real life: George Zisis. Phone +61 2 415 0515 


          				     O.   O   .O
         -m----------			       \.#-#./             
      ----mmm--------                         .'#####`.
   -------mmmmmm-----			     /  |   |  \
----------mmmmmmmmm--         --------------------|--------------------
                      	      Fly Inverted ....   | .... It confuses the hell
							 Out of the ducks....
#! rnews 2213
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rocky at polyof.poly.edu (A1 rocky shiotsuki (staff) )
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 15:47:24 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:18:01 GMT
Subject: xtank available for HP 9000 Series 400
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.154724.29966 at polyof.poly.edu>
Organization: Polytechnic University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!cs.utexas.edu!yale!cmcl2!polyof!rocky
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp,comp.windows.x,comp.source.x
Lines: 38
Xref: hplabs comp.sys.hp:1982 comp.windows.x:8161


    Hi everyone,

    Do you know about xtank?  I'm very new to xtank, so I can't
able to describe a detail, but I try my best.
    It is very impressive true interactive fully graphical
game, or war simulation for Xwindow environment. This program
is developed by Terry Donhue in Oct. 1987. Since then, Terry
and his friends modify and updated it.
    Inside of xtank, there are many new programming technique,
such as running many processes simultaneously, but not using
fork() function, and handle multiple Xservers, display, keyboard
and mouse, simultaneously. You will get know more when you read
a document for xtank.  Right now, xtank's source code size is
about 2.2 Mega bytes, and compressed one is 891561 bytes (after
I modified it).
    Right now, as I know, xtank only works for SUN workstation,
HP 9000 Series 800, APOLLO (I'm not sure), and Amiga.  But I got
chance to work with HP 9000 Series 400, so I modified xtank
spend some time in 4 days (between full time work), some how
it is working partially. So here is unofficial release xtank
for HP9000 Series 400. I sent e-mail and modified version of
xtank to stripes at eng.umd.edu.

xtank available from:
   ftp.eng.umd.edu   xtank1.2f.tar.Z  ; official version, but
				      ; does not work with
				      ; hp9000s400

   puscs.poly.edu    xtank1.2fb.tar.Z ; unofficital version
				      ; for hp9000s400

    I hope we will have special news group for xtank.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rocky Shiotsuki				Internet: rocky at puscs.poly.edu
Systems Programmer					128.238.5.8
Polytechnic University
333 Jay Street, Brooklyn, New York 11201
#! rnews 989
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: edp at jareth.enet.dec.com (Eric Postpischil (Always mount a scratch monkey.))
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 14:52:05 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:29 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Minehunt high score
Message-ID: <18251 at shlump.nac.dec.com>
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!ucbvax!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!purdue!haven!decuac!shlump.nac.dec.com!jareth.enet.dec.com!edp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <4813 at tellab5.tellabs.com> <17951 at shlump.nac.dec.com> <7360028 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Sender: newsdaemon at shlump.nac.dec.com
Reply-To: edp at jareth.enet.dec.com (Eric Postpischil (Always mount a scratch monkey.))
Lines: 9

More fun than "near 3 mines" immediately is to take the diagonal and get "near 7
mines".

Anyway, the new record for number of mines is:  54.


				-- edp (Eric Postpischil)
				"Always mount a scratch monkey."
				edp at jareth.enet.dec.com
#! rnews 2172
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: TNAN0 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 05:13:00 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:45 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Chip question
Message-ID: <F002EC16567F006FAC at ISUVAX.BITNET>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!sdd.hp.com!usc!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!apple!agate!shelby!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 33
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <TNAN0 at CCVAX.IASTATE.EDU>
To: handhelds at gac.edu
X-VMS-To: IN%"handhelds at gac.edu"

Howdy All!

   I do not have the source for CHIP, but I have noticed that typing MEM before
executing CHIP solves the problem (it works every time for me).  Is it possible
that the people having the problem are running relatively low on memory (6K is
pretty low if you are going to run CHIP)?  If so, perhaps CHIP doesn't perform
a garbage collection before it allocates the necessary 4K for the game string.
This is pure conjecture, of course, but perhaps automatic garbage collection
occurs when the calculator has been left alone for a few seconds and that is
why the problem doesn't occur if you wait before entering CHIP...  I never use
the on-screen clock, so I can't believe that this causes it...

  By the way, although I have not yet made it with 48 mines on MINEHUNT, I
would like to share my syzygy scores with you:

With borders:   630
Without borders: 963

I did not cheat or pause while earning these scores...  Lemme know if you beat
either...  (by the way, the score is only 3 digits...  Wonder what happens at
1000...?)


---Xeno

P.S.  I've been trying to write some stand alone (non-RPL-stack dependent)
programs...  What's the best way to locate and access relative memory
addresses?  For example, if I have a data area at the beginning of my code, it
seems to me the best way to access it would be to use a "thisone move.a pc,a"
followed by a "move.p5 thisone-dataarea,c" "sub.a c,a" thus leaving the address
of the data area in register A... is there a cleaner method?  And if not, what
assembler will handle this "distance between relative labels" function --
SASS sure won't!
#! rnews 2640
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: mike at DRD.Com (Mike Rovak)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 14:33:44 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:46 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Chip question
Message-ID: <1990Dec11.143344.21688 at DRD.Com>
Organization: DRD Corporation
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!sdd.hp.com!usc!apple!uokmax!d.cs.okstate.edu!drd!mike
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <7FAF2E7DE000201F at gacvx2.gac.edu>
Sender: Mike Rovak
Followup-to: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: backup frequently
Lines: 44
Summary: Aha!

TDSTRONG%MTUS5.BITNET at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU (Tim Strong) wrote:
} >...
} >Imagine my surprise the next day when TETRIS ran and accumulated score
} >without displaying any falling pieces.  Likewise, PUZZLE24, which I thought
} >was an RPL program, failed to run and required a system halt (ON-C) to return
} >to the stack display.  I looked at the INIT subroutine, and it had some
} >intersting and rather large binary integers and Externals in it, which I
} >could have sworn were not in the original code.  I immediately and without
} >question nor further debate executed the three-fingered salute (ON-A-F) and
} >cleared memory.  Reloaded from a good backup, downloaded what was missing,
} >didn't do anything questionable or anomalous, and voila, everything works
} >and memory is intact (then I made yet another backup).
} 
} I think I know why the RPL TETRIS sometimes corrupts memory.  I have found
} that TETRIS needs a binary wordsize of 64 (to be safe).  If the binary wordsize
} is not 64 the game acts as you descirbe corrupting itself and heaven knows
} what else.
} 
} The moral is if you want TETRIS on your machine and you play with the
} wordsize on your calculator alot add the following program to your TETRIS
} directory and run it instead of TETRIS:
} 
} << 64 STWS TETRIS >>
} 
} 'RUNTET'
} 
} STO
} 
} Hope this helps!

Thanks, Tim.  Your theory matches the observed facts.  When AS48 aborted,
the word size was left as 16 since the locals saved at the beginning of the
program got killed and never were recalled and reinstated.

I find it comforting somehow to know that in this particular case, there
was a logical explanation.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Disclaimer: My opinions do not necessarily reflect those of my employer.
========================================================================
------------------------------------------------------------------------
     mike at DRD.Com  
     uunet!apctrc!drd!mike
========================================================================
#! rnews 1811
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rrd at hpfcso.HP.COM (Ray Depew)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 18:20:19 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:30 GMT
Subject: Re: Burned-out infrared printer
Message-ID: <7360029 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!rrd
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpfcso.HP.COM
References: <4491 at altos86.Altos.COM>

Steve Scherf tells a spooky story:

>     [ The Case of the Fried Thermal Printhead ]

> I sent it back to HP and they replaced the whole unit under the warranty
> agreement. I'm afraid to use it now, though I'm sure the chance of a repeat
> performance is low. Has anyone else out there had this kind of experience?
> Is this a common thing for thermal printers?

Well, speaking as a user and not as an HP employee, I think you've experienced
a rare event.  Thermal printheads themselves are pretty sturdy, and something
like this would only happen if the control electronics inside got zapped.  If
you had disassembled your printer (which obviously you didn't for good
rea$on$), you would probably have seen some discolored components or circuit
traces.  (Well okay, maybe not...)

I own two of these printers and have access to several others, and they've 
survived lots of abuse without ever showing this problem.  However, I can
understand your not wanting to use the printer again.  I have the same 
irrational fear of placing my 48 in server mode and controlling all my 
file transfers from the PC.  Nothing bad has happened to me yet; it's just
a lot more comforting to do it all from the 48's keyboard.  Like I said,
totally irrational.

Regards
Ray Depew
IC's by Bill and Dave   
rrd at hpfitst1.hp.com
#! rnews 1051
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rrd at hpfcso.HP.COM (Ray Depew)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 20:20:41 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:30 GMT
Subject: Re: Burned-out infrared printer
Message-ID: <7360031 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!rrd
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpfcso.HP.COM
References: <4491 at altos86.Altos.COM>

What I MEANT to say:

> rare event.  Thermal printheads themselves are pretty sturdy, and something
> like this would only happen ...

" ... if the control electronics inside got zapped ALSO."  A dead short on
                                                   ^^^^
the right control ckt. would send enough voltage to the printhead to fry the
paper and the platen.  And the printhead.  But I think you're pretty safe
now.  People don't usually get struck by lightning twice.

Regards
Ray Depew
IC's by Bill and Dave   
rrd at hpfitst1.hp.com
----------
#! rnews 1320
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.joehorn at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Joseph K. Horn)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 06:40:04 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:14 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Xor_2Addr1Addr  address request
Message-ID: <2763287c:1367.5comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.joehorn
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <49399 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU> <10014 at jarthur.Claremont.EDU>
Lines: 13

Derek: Please do. The response to the EduCALC disk offer has been very
       good. It seems that there are a lot of folks who want HP48 stuff
       pre-digested and ready to use, and haven't the time or inclination
       to plow through daily downloads of incomprehensible bbs text.
       If you can, please use 3.5 or 5.25 inch, double or high density,
       IBM format disks.  If not, I can also transfer from Amiga 3.5,
       MacIntosh 3.5, Apple II 5.25, and TRSDOS 8-inch :-)

Bill: See HPCVBBS item #314 in the GENERAL conference for a complete
      description and sample directory of the first disk in what will
      hopefully become the HP48 equivalent of the Fred Fish disks for the
      Amiga.

--  Joseph K. Horn  --  (714) 858-0920  -- Peripheral Vision, Ltd.
#! rnews 1788
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: cloos at acsu.buffalo.edu (James H. Cloos)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 01:45:08 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Xor_2Addr1Addr  address request
Message-ID: <50406 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU>
Organization: State University of New York @ Buffalo
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!acsu.buffalo.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <49399 at eerie.acsu.Buffalo.EDU> <36637 at cup.portal.com>
Sender: news at acsu.Buffalo.EDU
Lines: 26
Nntp-Posting-Host: lictor.acsu.buffalo.edu

In article <36637 at cup.portal.com> Jake-S at cup.portal.com (Jake G Schwartz) writes:
|Jim, you mentioned that your list of internal RPL addresses did not include
|XOR_2Addr1Addr. Well that's okay. How about sharing the ones you DO know
|with the rest of us? I think there's a little clique here of folks "in the
|know" and folks who aren't in the know, and those who discovered the 
|precious addresses are not apt to spend any time sharing their findings
|here. Sounds a bit like the people at HP that you guys were complaining
|about. How about someone posting the definitive list a la Eric Toonen's
|list for the HP28 last year? We'll all benefit.
|
|Thanks,
|  
|Jake Schwartz


Nearly all of the addresses I do know came from either Jan (via sad's
stdsymbols and the article posted here (as I recall also by Jan) and
from Rick.  I am also working on the addresses for the routines called
directly by the usrlang commands, but that is not done yet.  I will
post my final .symbols file when it is done, though.

-JimC
--
James H. Cloos, Jr.		Phone:  +1 716 673-1250
cloos at ACSU.Buffalo.EDU		Snail:  PersonalZipCode:  14048-0772, USA
cloos at ub.UUCP			Quote:  <>
#! rnews 1325
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: rrd at hpfcso.HP.COM (Ray Depew)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 18:39:00 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:31 GMT
Subject: Re: BREAK and RETURN on the 48sx: where are they?
Message-ID: <7360030 at hpfcso.HP.COM>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!rrd
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Posting-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpfcso.HP.COM
References: <8601 at dog.ee.lbl.gov>

> As far as I can tell, the HP 48 doesn't provide any way to break out
> of a loop in the middle (in C, break), and doesn't provide any way to
> return from a function anywhere but the end.  (in C, return).  Yes, I
> know that it's always possible to avoid using these if you put in an
> extra test or flag, but sometimes they are convenient.

In his book "HP-41 / HP-48 Translations", Bill Wickes mentions that the
command << ... CONT ... >> breaks you out of a subroutine and back into the
next level.  I would think that you could include a local subroutine that 
would do your loop for you.

For example, the program

<<
.
.
<< a b FOR c
  .
  .
  .
  IF ... THEN CONT END
  .
  .
>>
.
-> loop
.
.
loop EVAL
.
.
>>

may do it for you.

-----
Regards
Ray Depew
IC's by Bill and Dave   
rrd at hpfitst1.hp.com
#! rnews 1433
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: nelson@ (Matt Nelson)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 1990 16:22:21 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:32 GMT
Subject: Re: MatrixWriter question
Message-ID: <276CF0BD.3492 at orion.oac.uci.edu>
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!!nelson
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <1990Dec17.010220.24504 at midway.uchicago.edu>
Reply-To: Matt Nelson <nelson at psroot.ps.uci.edu>
Lines: 19
Nntp-Posting-Host: skid.ps.uci.edu

In article <1990Dec17.010220.24504 at midway.uchicago.edu> keho at quads.uchicago.edu (thomas david kehoe) writes:

>Also, is there anyway to do an inverse cumulative distribution
>function?  In other words, UTPN returns the area under the
>upper tail of the normal distribution past x  (the value in
>level 1).  I often have the area under the upper tail, but
>need to find x.  No problem with the table in the back of a
>statistics book, but the 48SX can't do it..

use the solver.  suppose you had a distribution with mean=2.0 and
variance=0.5, and you wanted to find the value of x with the upper-
tail integral of 0.18.  enter the following program as EQ:

                << 2 0.5 X UTPN 0.18 - >>

go into the solver and hit (left shift)-X; you will be greeted with
"sign change" and X: 2.64726086088, which is good to 1E-12 or so.

have fun...  -matt
#! rnews 2012
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jurjen at cwi.nl (Jurjen NE Bos)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 12:31:21 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:16 GMT
Subject: Re: 32 Bt Mant is < I need!
Message-ID: <2667 at charon.cwi.nl>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!emory!gatech!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!mcsun!hp4nl!charon!jurjen
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <276057f4:1381comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP> <1990Dec10.034626.27415 at cc.ic.ac.uk> <10060 at jarthur.Claremont.EDU>
Sender: news at cwi.nl
Lines: 27

bgribble at jarthur.Claremont.EDU (Bill Gribble) writes:

>In article <1990Dec10.034626.27415 at cc.ic.ac.uk> umapd51 at cc.ic.ac.uk (W.A.C. Mier-Jedrzejowicz) writes:
>>
>It might be an interesting (if overly complex) project to try to implement
>  extended-precision math functions in machine language.  You would
>  have to hack a new type for entry and display - say, a string with the 
>  first character a # or somesuch.  But you could do arbitrarily high
>  precision math.  Left as an exercise for the reader :-)  

No! You don't!  The 48SX already has arbitrary-large binaries--except that
it cannot do computations with them.  The display routines can show
binaries of any size in the style
	C# <number of digits> <digits in reverse order hex>
but you cannot enter them.

If you want to see some of those numbers, look in the hidden directory (the
one with the empty name) and look in your alarm catalog.  Alarms are stored
like { B E } where B is a 24 nibble binary storing the date, time and
repeat interval, and E is the EXEC.
(For the nosy ones: this binary stores the value of TICKS of the time and
date of the alarm, prepeded by the number of ticks between to repetitions
of the alarm.  Funny format.  This list {B E} can be converted to RCLALARM
format with #E1D8 SYSEVAL, if I'm not mistaken.)

If only someone would write input and calculation routines for those
long binaries...
#! rnews 903
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jurjen at cwi.nl (Jurjen NE Bos)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 10:13:31 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:16 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 32 Bt Mant is < I need!
Message-ID: <2663 at charon.cwi.nl>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!uunet!mcsun!hp4nl!charon!jurjen
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <276057f4:1381comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Sender: news at cwi.nl
Lines: 9

akcs.scotty at hpcvbbs.UUCP (SCOTTY THOMPSON) writes:

>I need help.  Using binary numbers on my 48SX and trying to raise 2
>to the nth power to test a flag has become a difficult and unneccessary
>chore.

There is a simple trick: store the binary in your user flags (from memory:
do RCLF 1 ROT PUT STOF), test and set flags to taste, and do RCLF 1 GET.
No powering, no problems, gives you the full set of test instructions.
#! rnews 1452
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bson at rice-chex.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 16:20:00 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:30 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 32 Bt Mant is < I need!
Message-ID: <12330 at life.ai.mit.edu>
Organization: nil
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!cs.utexas.edu!yale!mintaka!ai-lab!rice-chex!bson
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <1990Dec10.034626.27415 at cc.ic.ac.uk> <10060 at jarthur.Claremont.EDU> <2667 at charon.cwi.nl>
Sender: news at ai.mit.edu
Lines: 23

In article <2667 at charon.cwi.nl> jurjen at cwi.nl (Jurjen NE Bos) writes:

 > The 48SX already has arbitrary-large binaries--except that it cannot
 > do computations with them.  ... If only someone would write input and
 > calculation routines for those long binaries...

   The HP-48 performs logical operations on strings, and since binary
numbers essentially are strings with a different type prefix, all we
have to do for AND, OR, XOR, NOT, is to bypass the type check:


	#188e6 SYSEVAL		AND strings
	#188f5 SYSEVAL		OR strings
	#18904 SYSEVAL		XOR strings
	#18961 SYSEVAL		NOT string


   In fact, these routines can be appled to any object that is a
"vector" object, i.e. a type prefix followed by a 20-bit length
counting the length itself - Library data, GROB, String, and Binary.

   So I guess what need are +, -, *, /, and a few shift operations,
and we're all set!
#! rnews 1645
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bgribble at jarthur.Claremont.EDU (Bill Gribble)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 07:01:56 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:19:50 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: 32 Bt Mant is < I need!
Message-ID: <10060 at jarthur.Claremont.EDU>
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hpcc05!hp-ptp!hp-ses!hpsdel!sdd.hp.com!usc!jarthur!bgribble
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <276057f4:1381comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP> <1990Dec10.034626.27415 at cc.ic.ac.uk>
Lines: 19

In article <1990Dec10.034626.27415 at cc.ic.ac.uk> umapd51 at cc.ic.ac.uk (W.A.C. Mier-Jedrzejowicz) writes:
>
>If you need really BIG binary numbers like this then an HP-16C is THE
>way to go! Of course, if you are using these BIG binary numbers as part
>of some other HP48SX operation then this is not much help :-(

It might be an interesting (if overly complex) project to try to implement
  extended-precision math functions in machine language.  You would
  have to hack a new type for entry and display - say, a string with the 
  first character a # or somesuch.  But you could do arbitrarily high
  precision math.  Left as an exercise for the reader :-)  

>Wlodek Mier-Jedrzejowicz, Space & Atmospheric Physics, Imperial College,
>London.

*****************************************************************************
**   Bill Gribble                     Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA   **
**   bgribble at jarthur.claremont.edu   Never heard of it?  You're stupid.   **
*****************************************************************************
#! rnews 2305
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: Jake-S at cup.portal.com (Jake G Schwartz)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 18:11:31 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:16 GMT
Subject: HP Videotapes, Conf. Proceedings, etc.
Message-ID: <36725 at cup.portal.com>
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!apple!portal!cup.portal.com!Jake-S
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 43

Hi -

    The Chicago "CHIP" HP users group finally ran out of copies of the June
HP Handheld Users' Conference proceedings.  For those who are interested in
obtaining a copy (110 pages of material), I have been given permission to
offer xeroxed copies here. Ten dollars will be sent back to the Chicago
group for every copy sold. Here's the rundown of tapes/proceedings at the
present time:

11/11/90  Philadelphia Area HP Handheld Club meeting.     $10.
          Bill Wickes guest speaker.                      (including
          Approx 4 hrs on one VHS tape, plus the           postage)
          18-page handout given to attendees.

6/1/90 -  Chicago HP Handheld User's Conference.          $15.
6/6/90    Several meetings and speakers including         (including 
          Bill Wickes and Eric Vogel of HP.                postage)
          Approx 16 hrs on two 8-hour VHS tapes,
          plus a 3-page synopsis of contents.

6/2/90 -  Chicago HP Conference proceedings. 110 pages    $12.50 if    
          including HP48 programs and several diagrams.   ordered with any
                                                          of the tapes;
                                                          $15.00 if ordered
                                                          separately.

6/2/90 -  "HP48 Goodies" Disk (originally supplied with   $1.00 if ordered
          conference proceedings) plus "HP48 SWAP02"      with anything
          disk of contributed stuff from attendees. Both  else.
          combined onto one disk.

Jake Schwartz
135 Saxby Terrace
Cherry Hill, NJ 08003

609-751-1310 home
609-866-6268 work

(I have tapes of several other HP users gatherings going back as far as
1986, including several HP product introductions by Corvallis employees.
Please contact me if interested. All are NTSC VHS format.)

 
#! rnews 1634
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: dmtg at vms.huji.ac.il (DAVID MAROSHI)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 11:22:53 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:16 GMT
Subject: Looking for extensive linear algebra programs (INFO ask)
Message-ID: <569 at shum.UUCP>
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem, Jerusalem, Israel
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!ucsd!ucselx!bionet!agate!ucbvax!vms.huji.ac.il!dmtg
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: usenet at ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Reply-To: dmtg at vms.huji.ac.il
Lines: 21


  Dear Everyone
I urgently need a program for the 28s that is able to amulate algebric
forms into matrices and then procces them regulary.It is too much truble
to start dealing with list objects,and writing all the arry procedures
for them.Probably a smart one wrote something wich enables one to solve
a matrice of variables (jaacobian for instance) and get the result
in algebric form.
Beside of that if somone in need I developed a program for multigrid
differential equation solving,and few useful algebric programs
to people who deal with quantum theory.


      THANKS DAVID MAROSHI
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  David Maroshi                             If all faills try read the
Physics dept          DMTG at VMS.HUJI.AC.IL                       INSTRUCTION !
Givat-Ram                by the Telnet      (Known distructive experimentalist)
Hebrew Uni Jerussalem  DMTG at HUJIVMS
Isreal                   by the Bitnet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#! rnews 1040
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: slv0y at cc.usu.edu
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 1990 08:46:13 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:17 GMT
Subject: For Sale: Portfolio
Message-ID: <1990Dec6.024614.43963 at cc.usu.edu>
Organization: Utah State University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jarthur!ucivax!orion.oac.uci.edu!ucsd!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!fcom.cc.utah.edu!cc.utah.edu!cc.usu.edu!slv0y
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 24

I have the following items for sale:

        Atari Portfolio
        Parallel Interface
        32K RAM Card
        AC Adaptor

        All Manuals and original packaging

All items in excellent condition, 1 year old.

I would like to sell as a package for $350. At that price I will pay
UPS 2nd day air (blue label) (within the US only!).

Offers to:

Jeffrey Barlow
Logan, Utah

(801) 752-6011 (Days)

email to: slv0y at cc.usu.edu  (Internet)
          MSU547            (Plink)
          J.BARLOW5         (Genie)
#! rnews 766
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: slwt7 at cc.usu.edu
Date: Sat, 8 Dec 1990 16:06:06 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:15:17 GMT
Subject: <None>
Message-ID: <1990Dec8.100606.44270 at cc.usu.edu>
Organization: Utah State University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!ucsd!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!fcom.cc.utah.edu!cc.utah.edu!cc.usu.edu!slwt7
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 10

Does anyone have the documentation to the symbolic matrix solving
program?  If so could you E-mail it to me.  It would be greatly appreciated
because I have to solve a lot of symbolic matices and I have the program
i just don't know how to use it!

Thanks,

Brian Wallis
Department of Engineering
Utah State
#! rnews 1371
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: YEE at rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu (Roger Yee)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 08:09:05 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:31 GMT
Subject: DTE48 terminal emulator
Message-ID: <6327 at quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu>
Organization: Ohio State University
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu!rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu!YEE
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: news at quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu
Lines: 20
Nntp-Posting-Host: rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu

Hello,

This note is primarily directed to Kevin Jessup.  I have downloaded the
previous message for the DTE48 V1.02 and used a friends cable to transfer it
to my calculator.  The problem comes in when trying to ASC-> the string.
(after removeing all the carriage returns like the instruction says).  I tried
to do this it and it says invalid string or something on that order.
I was wondering if someone has gotten this to work could send me a copy
in the uploaded ascii directory form (normal uploading no ->asc please).

By the way, The file I downloaded looked like this:

%%HP: T(3)A(D)F(.);    @ADDED THIS LIKE MOST PROGRAMS I HAVE SEEN HAVE
"69A20FF............."    @ONE LONG STRING

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Roger Yee  (YEE at RCGL1.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU)
#! rnews 807
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: newsuser at efd.lth.se (News server connection)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 22:07:51 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:31 GMT
Subject: HP41CX
Message-ID: <00940FC9.FA7CC0A0 at rigel.efd.lth.se>
Organization: Lund Institute of Technology,Lund, Sweden
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!ncar!gatech!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!lth.se!E89DH at rigel.efd.lth.se
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: newsuser at lth.se (LTH network news server)
Reply-To: e89dh at rigel.efd.lth.se
Lines: 6

Is there anybody out there who wants to sell a magnetic card reader for
the hp41cx, I am also interested in X-memory and the matematic module .

David Hultgren         E89DH at rigel.efd.lth.se
Lund Uni.
Sweden
#! rnews 842
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: newsuser at efd.lth.se (News server connection)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 22:23:38 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:31 GMT
Subject: RESET button on the 48SX
Message-ID: <00940FCC.2EB5F9C0 at rigel.efd.lth.se>
Organization: Lund Institute of Technology,Lund, Sweden
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!cs.utexas.edu!rutgers!gatech!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!lth.se!E89DH at rigel.efd.lth.se
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: newsuser at lth.se (LTH network news server)
Reply-To: e89dh at rigel.efd.lth.se
Lines: 9

What exactly does the hardware reset button under the rubberfoot on the
48SX do?  (since I am just upgrading my computer system, I am afraid for
a "Memory Lost")

David Hultgren
Lund Uni.
Sweden

E89DH at rigel.efd.lth.se
#! rnews 1995
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: graff at mlpvm2.iinus1.ibm.com ("Michael Graff")
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 19:04:37 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:32 GMT
Subject: Atari Portfolio developer prices
Message-ID: <9012101921.AA01270 at ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!ucsd!ucbvax!mlpvm2.iinus1.ibm.com!graff
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Sender: daemon at ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Reply-To: graff at mlpvm2.iinus1.ibm.com
Lines: 35

I ordered the latest developer info pack from Atari, and it's
different from the info posted here a few days ago.

First, you're required to sign up as a developer and order the
developer starter kit for $160.  The starter kit includes the tech
ref, the emulator software (for testing Pofo programs on a regular
PC), and one year of developer technical support.

The sign-up form asks all kinds of questions like how many programmers
do you have and what will you be developing and when will it be
released.  Also, you need to sign a non-disclosure agreement.  It's
not clear, however, if they would turn you down if you simply said you
wanted to develop software for your own personal use.

Once you've signed up, the prices for the individual Pofo items are
very good (price list dated 10/26/90):

   Portfolio              $195
   Parallel interface       25
   Serial interface         40
   AC adapter                5
   32K RAM card             40
   64K RAM card             65
   128K RAM card           100
   PC card drive            50

They also have prices for EPROM cards and EPROM writer adapter boards.

If you just want a few things, you're probably better off just
ordering them from a mail order firm like J&R Music World and avoiding
all the paperwork since the $160 starter kit would offset any price
savings.  But if you really are interested in developing programs for
the Pofo, the developer prices are really nice.

--Michael
#! rnews 796
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: jsims at vuse.vanderbilt.edu (J. Robert Sims)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 21:14:51 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:32 GMT
Subject: FFT program request
Message-ID: <9012102114.AA04669 at vuse.vanderbilt.edu>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!news.cs.indiana.edu!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 7
To: handhelds at gac.edu
Return-path: <jsims at vuse.vanderbilt.edu>
To: handhelds at gac.edu

Somebody posted a complete FFT program recently, and I promptly lost it.
It included FFT and inverse FFT functions, and was quite short.  I would
appreciate it if anyone who has this program would email it to me.

Thanks in advance,
Rob
jsims at vuse.vanderbilt.edu
#! rnews 1071
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: foucher at caen.engin.umich.edu (Bradley S Foucher)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 22:58:08 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:41 GMT
Subject: Disable ON-C?
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.225808.5389 at engin.umich.edu>
Organization: The University of Michigan, Ann Arbor
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!caen!tumeric.engin.umich.edu!foucher
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Distribution: usa
Sender: news at engin.umich.edu (CAEN Netnews)
Keywords: HP 48sx Fellow Network Users,
Lines: 9


	I'm wondering if there is a way to disable the ON-C and other ON-
keygroups.  I'm looking into writing a password program that runs like the 
protection program in Wayne Scott's list.  The obvious downfall is that all
you have to do to break through is press ON-C or ON-A-F.  I know absolutely
nothing about machine language, but I'm sure some of you gurus out there
may have an idea on how to solve my problem.  Any help would be appreciated.
					Brad Foucher
					foucher at caen.engin.umich.edu
#! rnews 1521
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: bobc at hplsla.HP.COM (Bob Cutler)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 17:59:51 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:44 GMT
Subject: Re: Convolution Algerbra
Message-ID: <10130001 at hplsla.HP.COM>
Organization: HP Lake Stevens, WA
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hplsla!bobc
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <1990Dec8.224427.513 at en.ecn.purdue.edu>
Lines: 51

Here's a program I've been using on my 28s.  There's probably a more 
efficient way to write a convolution program, but what the heck, it works.

CONV expects two vectors on the stack as input and returns a vector.

For example, 

        To solve:

               (3x^2 +2x + 1)( x + 5)

        Enter:
               [3 2 1] [ 1 5] 'CONV'

        The result is

              [ 3 17 11 5]  or  (3x^4 + 17x^2 + 11x + 5)

Enjoy,
					
					Bob Cutler
					KE7ZJ
					Hewlett-Packard
					Lake Stevens Instrument Division
					Everett, WA 98205

----------------------------------------------------------------------

'CONV'
<< -> A
  << -> B
     << A SIZE LIST-> DROP 
         B SIZE LIST-> DROP 
         + 1 - -> N
         << A N 1 -> LIST
            RDM -> A
            << B N 1 ->LIST 
               RDM -> B
               << 1 N FOR 
                  I 0 
                  1 I FOR 
                  J A J GET B I J - 1 + GET * +
                  NEXT
               NEXT 
            N -> ARRY
          >> 
        >> 
      >> 
    >> 
  >> 
>> 
#! rnews 8081
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.kevin at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Kevin Jessup)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 23:40:08 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:48 GMT
Subject: DTE48 Terminal Emulator
Message-ID: <276418eb:1405comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.kevin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: 2nd upload
Lines: 163

For some reason, my previous upload of DTE48 lost some characters.
Let's try it again...

A few people have been asking for DTE48, a terminal emulator program
for the 48SX.  Unless someone else out there has created a program
with the same name, here is what you have been asking for...

*********************************************************************
*              DOCUMENTATION FILE FOR DTE48  V1.02                  *
*********************************************************************

DTE48 is a Dumb Terminal Emulator program for the HP48SX.  "Dumb"
implies that the terminal cannot be read by a remote system or
respond to inquiry commands like a VT100.

At least 3 other "terminal" programs have been posted for the 48SX.
All have various limitations.  This one is not necesarily better
than any of the others.

Version 1.02 differs from previous versions in that incomming carriage
returns are replaced with an ASCII space before display.  A more
generic SRCHREPL (search and replace) string function has been sustituted
for the previous FILTER function.  Note that SRCHREPL requires MULTI
which is also provided.  Incomming linefeed characters are stripped!
The main program, DTE48, can be modified so as to replace linefeeds with
a space or any other character.

FEATURES
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1.)    Tramsmits upper and lower case as well as all of the ASCII
       control characters.
2.)    Characters are displayed AS THEY ARRIVE, not only when a full
       line is available.
3.)    The screen can be paused at any time.  This assumes the trans-
       mitting system handles XON/XOFF protocol and will not time-out
       and start resending!!
4.)    7 line by 22 character scrolling display.

LIMITATIONS
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1.)    Probably not 100% reliable at 9600 baud.
2.)    Control characters (ASCII 1 thru 26) are not processed and
       are displayed as a dot.  Checking each individual character
       so as to process tabs, carriage returns and linefeeds slows
       it down too much.  An assembly language version is needed.

FILES
--------------------------------------------------------------------
There are five.  DTE48 is the main executable.  KEYMAP is a string
used for keycode translation.  TOGF is a flag toggling function.
SRCHREPL strips or replaces characters in strings.  MULTI performs an
operation till the results no longer change.  Place the files in the
directory of your choice.

FILE       BYTES       CHECKSUM (HEX)
--------   -----       --------------
DTE48      636.0       # 81C8
SRCHREPL   145.5       # FD08
KEYMAP     304.5       # 5BFC
TOGF        38.5       # 921E
MULTI       56.0       # 8FCF

RUNNING IT
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Setup the 48SX I/O for the required baud rate and enable XON/XOFF
protocol.  If you don't know what that means, read the manual!
Hit DTE48 to run.  Here is an example of the IOPAR list with XON/XOFF
enabled:   { 4800 0 1 1 3 3 }

Characters will be displayed starting on the bottom line and lines
will scroll upwards as needed.

KEY        UNSHIFTED RESULT   LEFT SHIFTED RESULT   RIGHT SHIFTED RESULT
--------   ----------------   -------------------   --------------------
A          a                  A                     ^A (ASCII 1)
B          b                  B                     ^B (ASCII 2)
C          c                  C                     ^C (ASCII 3)...

Z          z                  Z                     ^Z (ASCII 26)

1          1                  !
2          2                  @
3          3                  #
4          4                  $
5          5                  %
6          6                  ^
7          7                  &
8          8                  *
9          9                  (
0          0                  )
*          *                  ,
-          -                  _    (underscore)
+          +                  =
.          .                  <
SPC        space              >
<-         backspace          delete
ENTER      carriage return    linefeed
DEL        QUIT               QUIT

                                                  
Hitting the ALPHA key will pause the display.  Hit it again to
continue.  The left shift and right shift keys are active for
one keystroke only.

All keys not defined above generate a space.

DISCLAIMERS
------------------------------------------------------------------
NOTHING is guaranteed.  I may or may not provide new and/or assembly
language versions.  Use it at your own risk.  Hack away at it and repost
only if you give me credit for the original version.

Kevin Jessup
9118 N. 85th St
Milwaukee, WI 53224

Office:    (414) 362-2020
Home:      (414) 355-9752

Here is the ASCII string for the DTE48 directory object.  Use ASC->
to convert it...

[CUT HERE]
"69A20FF7349000000050D455C4459450D9D20E16321C432D6E201007E16323C03278BF1D6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"[CUT HERE]

Make sure all carriage return characters (0d hex) are removed from
the ASCII string before you attempt to checksum it or convert it
using ASC-> .

Checksum for ASCII string (string on stack): D25F hex
Byte count: 2508.5
#! rnews 829
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.tyrone at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Tyrone Johnson)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 16:40:07 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:46 GMT
Subject: Re: DTE48 Terminal Emulator
Message-ID: <27650962:1405.1comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.tyrone
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <276418eb:1405comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Keywords: 2nd upload
Lines: 5

I just download the above string and am not able to get the correct
Checksum or  Byte count on my 48.  I've done it 3 times to make sure that
I was not losing anything along the way, but no luck.  
I get Checksum: 7802 hex
     Byte count: 2458
Is it possible to have lost characters again while uploading it?
#! rnews 566
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.joehorn at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Joseph K. Horn)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 1990 04:40:04 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:18:38 GMT
Subject: Re: DTE48 Terminal Emulator
Message-ID: <2765b292:1411.1comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.joehorn
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <9012110010.AA08282 at internal.apple.com>
Lines: 1

Roger: Try NOT removing the carriage returns.  ASC-> expects them.
-jkh-
#! rnews 622
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.kevin at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Kevin Jessup)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 1990 18:40:14 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 00:19:51 GMT
Subject: Re: DTE48 Terminal Emulator
Message-ID: <27666e9a:1411.2comp.sys.handhelds;1 at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.kevin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
References: <9012110010.AA08282 at internal.apple.com> <2765b292:1411.1comp.sys.ha
Lines: 4

See item 1409 in this conferance.  It has a good copy of DTE48.
Sorry about the upload problems.

Kevin J.
#! rnews 1026
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: akcs.mitchell at hpcvbbs.UUCP (Mitchell Dickerman)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 1990 01:40:04 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:48 GMT
Subject: Relation plotter wanted
Message-ID: <276432b1:1406comp.sys.handhelds at hpcvbbs.UUCP>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!hp-pcd!hpcvra.cv.hp.com!rnews!hpcvbbs!akcs.mitchell
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Keywords: relation plotter
Lines: 10

Long ago, I had a wonderful program that plotted relations, i.e.
if you gave it X^2+Y^2-1, it drew the unit circle. I would love to
see a program like this for my 48, but I'm not much of a programmer.
In order to plot f(x,y)=0, one would have to begin with the pixel
in the upper left hand corner, and check the 3 adjacent pixels and
compare the sign of f(x,y) evaluated at those points. If a sign change
occured, it indicates a solution of f(x,y)=0, and that pixel should
be turned on. Am I making sense? Can someone give me a hand implementing
this?

Mitch
#! rnews 3739
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: handhelds at gac.edu (handhelds at gac.edu)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 17:48:15 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:48 GMT
Subject: Can't Find MailCenter!
Message-ID: <9012110010.AA08259 at internal.apple.com>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!src.honeywell.com!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 73
To: Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com
Return-path: <handhelds at gac.edu>
To: Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com

Mail*Link#170#                    HP Videotapes, Conf. Procee
Received: by gateway.qm.apple.com; 9 Dec 90 12:48:14
Received: from apple.com by goofy.apple.com with SMTP (5.61/25-eef)
	id AA16770; Sun, 9 Dec 90 12:44:12 -0800
	for Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com
Received: from gacvx2.gac.edu by apple.com with SMTP (5.61/25-eef)
	id AA23594; Sun, 9 Dec 90 12:44:02 -0800
	for Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 14:40 CST
From: handhelds at gac.edu
Subject: HP Videotapes, Conf. Proceedings, etc.
Sender: NEWSMGR at gacvx2.gac.edu
To: HANDHELDS at gacvx2.gac.edu
Errors-To: postmaster at gac.edu
Reply-To: handhelds at gac.edu
Message-Id: <EC303F42A0001B8D at gacvx2.gac.edu>
X-Vms-To: IN%"HANDHELDS at GACVX2.GAC.EDU"
Comments: Forwarded from COMP.SYS.HANDHELDS by GACVX2.GAC.EDU

Relay-Version: VMS News - V6.0 13/10/90 VAX/VMS V5.4; site gacvx2.gac.edu
Path:
gacvx2.gac.edu!noc.MR.NET!msi.umn.edu!news.cs.indiana.edu!att!linac!uwm.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!apple!portal!cup.portal.com!Jake-S
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Subject: HP Videotapes, Conf. Proceedings, etc.
Message-ID: <36725 at cup.portal.com>
From: Jake-S at cup.portal.com (Jake G Schwartz)
Date: 9 Dec 90 18:11:31 GMT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Lines: 43

Hi -

    The Chicago "CHIP" HP users group finally ran out of copies of the June
HP Handheld Users' Conference proceedings.  For those who are interested in
obtaining a copy (110 pages of material), I have been given permission to
offer xeroxed copies here. Ten dollars will be sent back to the Chicago
group for every copy sold. Here's the rundown of tapes/proceedings at the
present time:

11/11/90  Philadelphia Area HP Handheld Club meeting.     $10.
          Bill Wickes guest speaker.                      (including
          Approx 4 hrs on one VHS tape, plus the           postage)
          18-page handout given to attendees.

6/1/90 -  Chicago HP Handheld User's Conference.          $15.
6/6/90    Several meetings and speakers including         (including 
          Bill Wickes and Eric Vogel of HP.                postage)
          Approx 16 hrs on two 8-hour VHS tapes,
          plus a 3-page synopsis of contents.

6/2/90 -  Chicago HP Conference proceedings. 110 pages    $12.50 if    
          including HP48 programs and several diagrams.   ordered with any
                                                          of the tapes;
                                                          $15.00 if ordered
                                                          separately.

6/2/90 -  "HP48 Goodies" Disk (originally supplied with   $1.00 if ordered
          conference proceedings) plus "HP48 SWAP02"      with anything
          disk of contributed stuff from attendees. Both  else.
          combined onto one disk.

Jake Schwartz
135 Saxby Terrace
Cherry Hill, NJ 08003

609-751-1310 home
609-866-6268 work

(I have tapes of several other HP users gatherings going back as far as
1986, including several HP product introductions by Corvallis employees.
Please contact me if interested. All are NTSC VHS format.)

 
#! rnews 2707
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: handhelds at gac.edu (handhelds at gac.edu)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 11:09:41 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:49 GMT
Subject: Can't Find MailCenter!
Message-ID: <9012110010.AA08282 at internal.apple.com>
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!samsung!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!src.honeywell.com!msi.umn.edu!noc.MR.NET!gacvx2.gac.edu!hhdist
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 54
To: Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com
Return-path: <handhelds at gac.edu>
To: Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com

Mail*Link#170#                    DTE48 terminal emulator
Received: by gateway.qm.apple.com; 9 Dec 90 06:09:39
Received: from apple.com by goofy.apple.com with SMTP (5.61/25-eef)
	id AA20841; Sun, 9 Dec 90 04:10:09 -0800
	for winters
Received: from gacvx2.gac.edu by apple.com with SMTP (5.61/25-eef)
	id AA08700; Sun, 9 Dec 90 04:09:53 -0800
	for Steve_Winters.PERIPH_PROJ at gateway.qm.apple.com
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 06:06 CST
From: handhelds at gac.edu
Subject: DTE48 terminal emulator
Sender: NEWSMGR at gacvx2.gac.edu
To: HANDHELDS at gacvx2.gac.edu
Errors-To: postmaster at gac.edu
Reply-To: handhelds at gac.edu
Message-Id: <A4611D1B60001B36 at gacvx2.gac.edu>
X-Vms-To: IN%"HANDHELDS at GACVX2.GAC.EDU"
Comments: Forwarded from COMP.SYS.HANDHELDS by GACVX2.GAC.EDU

Relay-Version: VMS News - V6.0 13/10/90 VAX/VMS V5.4; site gacvx2.gac.edu
Path:
gacvx2.gac.edu!noc.MR.NET!msi.umn.edu!src.honeywell.com!uwm.edu!wuarchive!usc!

zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu!rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu!YEE
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Subject: DTE48 terminal emulator
Message-ID: <6327 at quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu>
From: YEE at rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu (Roger Yee)
Date: 9 Dec 90 08:09:05 GMT
Sender: news at quanta.eng.ohio-state.edu
Organization: Ohio State University
Nntp-Posting-Host: rcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu
Lines: 20

Hello,

This note is primarily directed to Kevin Jessup.  I have downloaded the
previous message for the DTE48 V1.02 and used a friends cable to transfer it
to my calculator.  The problem comes in when trying to ASC-> the string.
(after removeing all the carriage returns like the instruction says).  I tried
to do this it and it says invalid string or something on that order.
I was wondering if someone has gotten this to work could send me a copy
in the uploaded ascii directory form (normal uploading no ->asc please).

By the way, The file I downloaded looked like this:

%%HP: T(3)A(D)F(.);    @ADDED THIS LIKE MOST PROGRAMS I HAVE SEEN HAVE
"69A20FF............."    @ONE LONG STRING

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Roger Yee  (YEE at RCGL1.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU)
#! rnews 1602
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: wscott at en.ecn.purdue.edu (Wayne H Scott)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 1990 20:11:54 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:16:51 GMT
Subject: ASC to bin program
Message-ID: <1990Dec9.201154.21797 at en.ecn.purdue.edu>
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!usc!samsung!noose.ecn.purdue.edu!en.ecn.purdue.edu!wscott
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 38


The following is a script that I have found useful.  It will read a
text file containing a program encoded in the ->ASC format and 
extract the binary file. 

I use this to speed downloads to my HP.  And I don't need the ->ASC program
on the 48.

It is written in perl so I realize that many people will not be able to
use it.  Someday the rest of the world will understand.

#!/usr/unsup/perl

# unasc

# A perl program to extract a HP-48 binary from a text file containing a 
# ->ASC program. 
#
# Usage: unasc file > binfile
#
# Written by Wayne Scott  1990

while (<>) {
	next if (!(/^%%HP/../"$/)); 	# Skip everything but program
	chop;				
	$file .= $_;		
}

$file =~ s/.*"(\w*)\w\w\w\w".*/\1/;	# strip newlines, ", and CRC

$file =~ s/(.)(.)/pack(C,hex(\1.\2))/eg;  # convert ascii to bin

print $file;
-- 
_______________________________________________________________________________
Wayne Scott             |  INTERNET:   wscott at ecn.purdue.edu
Electrical Engineering  |  BITNET:     wscott%ecn.purdue.edu at purccvm
Purdue University       |  UUCP:      {purdue, pur-ee}!ecn.purdue.edu!wscott
#! rnews 1406
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: arisz at sco.COM (Aris Zakinthinos)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 1990 19:03:45 GMT
Date-Received: Tue, 18 Dec 1990 23:18:46 GMT
Subject: Information Requested
Message-ID: <1990Dec10.190345.16178 at sco.COM>
Organization: SCO Canada, Inc. (formerly HCR Corporation)
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!samsung!uunet!attcan!ncrcan!scocan!arisz
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Distribution: na
Sender: news at sco.COM (News administration)
Lines: 17


I am a University of Waterloo co-op student and I will be heading back
to school in a little while.  I wish to get a new calculator but I am
not sure what to get.  Next term I am going to be taking a course on
semi-conducters and need (want 8-) a calculator that does matrices with complex
elements and (hopefuly) will allow to leave a frequency variable and
have it solve the matrix symbolicaly.  As you can probably tell I need this
calculator mostly for circuit analysis.  In my other circuit analysis courses
I had to solve those blody matices by hand (yuk!) so this time I want to be
better prepared.  I have looked into both the 28S and 48SX but don't know 
enough about either to make an educated choice.  Any help would be apreciated.

You can either post or mail me directly my net address is scocan!arisz

Thanks in advance,

Aris Zakinthinos.
#! rnews 565
Relay-Version: version Notes 2.8.4  1990/05/09; site hpuslma.STLOUIS.HP.COM
From: johankha at tz.wimsey.bc.ca (Johan Khafra)
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 1990 20:53:40 GMT
Date-Received: Wed, 19 Dec 1990 02:16:33 GMT
Subject: Synthetic Programming
Message-ID: <6Jiau1w163w at tz.wimsey.bc.ca>
Organization: Somewhere in The Twilight Zone, Van, B.C
Path: hpuslma!hpfcse!hpfcmgw!hpfcso!hplabs!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!van-bc!cynic!tz!johankha
Newsgroups: comp.sys.handhelds
Lines: 2

That book is called "Synthetic Programming for the 41" written by William C. 
Wickes.  

#! rnews 527
Path: monsanto.com!kncarp
From: kncarp at monsanto.com
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: News test, please respond.
Message-ID: <1990Dec26.121541.3051 at monsanto.com>
Date: 26 Dec 90 12:15:41 -7
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO
Lines: 6

Sorry to waste bandwidth, but we seem to be having problems posting to news.
Would somebody (everybody?) who reads this please email me a "I got it" message.

Kevin Carpenter
kncarp at nicsn1.monsanto.com
(sci.astro is my favorite board, if you can't pester friends, who can you pester)



More information about the Bioforum mailing list