"another" and "better" career alternative?.....

Arthur Sowers arthures at magpage.com
Sun Jan 14 21:00:24 EST 2001


Why should you think that all programmer jobs pay more than all
non-programmer jobs?

On Sat, 13 Jan 2001, John Jacobson wrote:

> No, I got your point exactly. Again, why should every job that a PhD is in
> be better than every job that non-PhD's are in? (Not to mention the fact
> that your example did not demonstrate this)

There really are a lot of jobs out there that do not require any college
and they pay more than a lot of jobs that do require college. The
electrician that worked on my new house gets $55/hour and he works out of
his home (i.e. no overhead other than his truck). Try to beat that.

=== no change to below, included for reference and context ====

> "Arthur Sowers" <arthures at magpage.com> wrote in message
> news:93i572$nt9$0 at 216.155.0.50...
> >
> > In a way, you did get my point. The rest of my point is that often these
> > jobs pay better than jobs that PhDs are in. Also, PhDs and laid off
> > programmers can do quite well if they are willing to change their goals.
> >
> > Art
> >
> > On Tue, 9 Jan 2001, John Jacobson wrote:
> >
> > > I don't get your point. Of course there are plenty of good-paying
> business
> > > opportunities and jobs for people who don't have PhD's. Why *shouldn't*
> that
> > > be the case? Wages and compensation are not simple linear functions of
> > > education.
> > >
> > > "Arthur Sowers" <arthures at magpage.com> wrote in message
> > > news:93e884$mka$0 at 216.155.0.50...
> > > >
> > > > On mainly sci.research.careers I have, over the last couple of years
> > > > occassionally posted information about jobs/careers that are: i) low
> > > > tech,, ii) blue collar, iii) etc., that pay as well, and sometimes
> more,
> > > > and require less formal education and credentials than sci-engineering
> > > > jobs and have more long term job security and more immunity to
> > > > age-discrimination.
> > > >
> > > > For those who don't know me, I am a 57 year-old, formerly grant funded
> > > > ex-research professor who lost his career in 1995-6 throught the
> "grant
> > > > lottery" where funding is dependent more on what is trendy than what
> is
> > > > competant reserch.
> > > >
> > > > Here is another one: small company movers. Yes, as in moving
> furniture,
> > > > belongings, etc., from one house to another. We just had a load of
> > > > belongings moved from our old house to our new house and I asked a lot
> of
> > > > questions about the business. Here is the lowdown:
> > > >
> > > > The company is made up of essentially two guys (the owner/manager and
> his
> > > > "sidekick"). There is a wife or sister who answers the phone on
> weekdays
> > > > and sets up some scheduling. They own a truck with a 22 foot box, and
> the
> > > > truck is a six wheel job that can carry about  8,000 lbs. The
> > > > owner/manager has been in this business for 19 years and in response
> to my
> > > > question, not complaining about anything. The sidekick has been doing
> this
> > > > for 9 years and in response to my question is not looking for anything
> > > > better in the line of work.
> > > >
> > > > Our "move" took them just under 2 hours to load, about 2 hours road
> time
> > > > from old house to new house, about 2-3 hourse to unload. Total bill:
> $750.
> > > >
> > > > The main overhead is the truck. The guy uses about $7,000 in diesel
> fuel
> > > > per year, and puts in about $8,000 in maintenance on the truck. They
> are
> > > > working continuously 6 days per week. The owner/manager, a quite
> > > > intelligent and articulate guy (I did not ask if he had a PhD in
> > > > anything), bids low on jobs and gets most of the jobs he bids on.
> Assuming
> > > > the truck is working 265 days per year, then his primary overhead is
> about
> > > > $50 per day for the truck (cf. Uhaul rates for a medium sized truck
> which
> > > > would be a daily fee plus per mile fees that might run up to maybe
> $100+
> > > > but surely not over $200 for a run such as ours). This leaves,
> basically,
> > > > $750 minus $100, or 650 per two guys, or basically $325 each for a
> basic
> > > > day of sweatwork that is roughly eight hours in length. I think most
> of
> > > > the guys on this NG should be able to do a rough back-of-the-envelope
> per
> > > > hour estimate of what these guys might be getting on an hourly basis.
> They
> > > > surely make a little less because they are paying the girl back in the
> > > > office (at someone's home) something to answer the phone, pay for
> adverts
> > > > in the local yellow pages (a few hundred per year), and pay for
> business
> > > > cards, and maybe payments on the truck (such trucks, if you buy one
> > > > outright can be from $50K, used, to $100K new, but you could
> rent/lease
> > > > one for roughly $100 per day, too).
> > > >
> > > > A United Van Lines rep came out to bid on the same exact job and gave
> us
> > > > an estimate for, believe it or not, $1700, and gave us the exact same
> > > > "time and effort" estimate for doing the job. UVL surely has more
> overhead
> > > > costs to pay for national advertizing, pay for some overpaid and
> > > > underperforming CEO/executives and their entourage, and high rent
> district
> > > > office building wherever they have their national headquarters.
> > > >
> > > > One last item: we packed all boxes ourselves. They just loaded &
> > > > unloaded. The bulky heavy furniture, including washer, dryer,
> > > > refrigerators, etc., they carried onto truck and wrapped in mover's
> > > > quilts. The local guys were very good, very professional. I did a lot
> of
> > > > schmoozing with the owner/operator and when I asked where he lived, he
> > > > gave a community of mid range housing where I know the houses are in
> the
> > > > 300K-400K price range and this is not a high rent district area of the
> > > > country like Silicon Valley. So, I'd say the guy is doing fairly well
> and
> > > > certainly better than many PhDs (and laid-off programmers, engineers,
> and
> > > > others that, when they reach an age of 40 or so, start having trouble
> > > > finding new work AND are exposed to company/economy induced layoffs).
> > > >
> > > > The owner/manager also told me that he previoulsly worked as the
> > > > "sidekick" in another small company situated about 20-30 miles away
> and
> > > > then split off on his own many years ago and he sees, and has seen in
> the
> > > > past, nothing but growth ahead in this business. He never gave any
> > > > indications of worrys or concerns about crap, politics, concerns,
> etc., in
> > > > his line of business.
> > > >
> > > >   Arthur E. Sowers, PhD
> > > >   -----------------------------------------
> > > >   | Science career information website:   |
> > > >   | http://www.magpage.com/~arthures      |
> > > >   -----------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> 
> 
> 






More information about the Bioforum mailing list