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cijadra at zedat.fu-berlin.de cijadra at zedat.fu-berlin.de
Sun Apr 19 01:06:53 EST 1998


>Maybe so. I studied Crowley, Regardie, Franz Bardon and others.
I do not know the latter two and the bit I heard about the first
seemed rather mad to me.

>I have never met anybody who can *do* anything. It is all in
>the imagination and by that I mean no physical consequences.
Ah, and because YOU never met anybody who can do anything it is not
there?
>You cannot *do* anything either. Just delusional talk.
I think you are the one who is delusional.
You presume to know that just because you never met anyone who can do
magick that no one can do it.
Tht is delusional.
That would be like me saying because I never saw anyone fly to the
mooon that no one ever did and that all claims along that line are a
line  and all T.V. stuff some fake made up stuff.

And I also find it intersting that you can judge from whereever YOU
are what I can do...
So which part of what I said I can do or could do in the past is
delusional?
And how do you know that, since you were not around at the time?

>There are no witches in Germany nor anywhere else.
Ah, I am sure you know all 80 million Germans personally to know that
the Christians really killed all in the times of burning and
torturing, and that you are perfectly sure that though they have
learned to keep very secret over the centuries of persecution,
that there are none left.

I am deeply impressed.

I would not have thought I could check out 80 million in my life, and
that you can do it that fast is impressive.

>There are no magical arts. There are no spirits. 

Of course there are.

Say, are you metnally limited to the colour sight of your eyes or
what?
Are you some sense-censored Christian just using the five senses they
want you to use, like some sheep of the big Catholic shephard?
Probably.
There are so many peoples practicing magick on this planet, that one
would nearly have to be retarded not to get it.

I could go to people in this country, in India, in Australia, in
Sounth America, in Middle America, .... and ask around and anyone not
dumb like a brick would be likely to know a bit about it , even if he
himself is not practicing.

To not know would be like not knowing what 400+400 is.

Maybe you should work on your education first.

Yiou sound like some Chrisian Westie who was taught not to use his
senses  and remains in blissful dumbness to inherit Heaven.

>I mean there
>is nothing related to this that actually exists.
It is called "physics" and "biology" and "will-power"in the west.
It just does not exist for you because you do not want it to exist.
You restrict yourself to the narrow bands of frequencies of hearing
and colour-seeing and from there with your prejudices wish to judge
how many witches there are among 80million Germans and what is there
in the world.

>There was never data in there in the first place. 
There is data of centuries if not thousands of years of research in
there. He mentions travelling vast distances with the mind, flying and
other stuff. There are instructions about dream-perceiving, how to
learn what he calls "seeing", how to use the water, and a bunch of
psychological tricks and a lot more.
Maybe you are so stupid that you really do not see data when it is in
front of you.
The trick with the flying I likely will not learn in the time of my
life.

>This series of books was occult science fiction. There was no Don Juan.
There might have been no Don Juan, as the data about him is not
congruent, but it is definitely not Castaneda's He is too dumb for
that. In the start he understands about as much about magick as you.
I find it unlikely that someone like him would co from zero to data
that must have taken centuries if not thousands of years of research.
And it is not science fiction.
It are fractions of data of cultures that have researched the mind
since humans can think enough for that  and that was destroyed to vast
extents by the Europeans.
It is the equivalent of science of Middle America.
Because you are uneducate in their ways you do not understand.
The same as there someone might not be able to read, you are not able
to "see" or to stay awake and extend fields in your dreams.

>Anyone who objected to this book had no clue about sorcery,
>or any occult, religious, paranormal understanding, because
>there is no such thing.
Ah, so there are no religions, no occult and no sorcerers.
I am sure the religions and the sorcerers and the occult groups of the
world will agree completely with you.

>People have been called different things. But they are not special;
And old whatever says: "All people are even."
A sorcerer has his knowledge, a mother of eight children her
knowledge, a builder of houses his knowledge, a midwife her
knowledge,...
All humans are special on a level, cause they are only there once in
this universe.
>just ordinary people who have built on people's superstitions.
Some do that, and if you work as a healer or religious cousellor at
the same time that is important; espeically in many other societies.

>> Let me ask you a basic questions:
>> 
>> 1.:How does Carlos Castaneda's "seeing" work?
>> 
>It doesn't. There is no such thing. 

Of course it does.
I can do it and I know dozens of people who understand it a bit.

You are just too dumb to get it.
That is what I mean.
One of the most basic things, and you cannot do them.
And because YOU are too stupid to learn what some others learn within
4 hours (though that is exceptionally fast) it does not exist.

There can be an American author telling about somebody in Mexico and
you can have a German veryfying that what he says is correct, and you
could have half of the planet standing in front of you and say that it
is correct, and still just cause YOU are too dumb to have enough self
control to take the colour transition out or/and to change energy
levels of the sectors in your brain so you can alter the waves you
send and can perceive on the other ranges,
you say it is not possible.

You are the one living in delusions.
You are too lazy to learn what others learn and then excuse your
laziness and dumbness by saying that what has been known and
researched in dozens if not hundreds of cultures does not exist.

Of course witches exist in Germany; if you really believe burning them
for some centuries has killed ALL the knowledge you are mistaken.
The Catholics and your type might hope so or assume, and go on to
supress the knowledge, but you are like the blind laughed at or
accepted as retarded children of Earth by many of the perceiving.

>There is no such thing as projected auras. There is no manipulation
>of energy fields. That talk is superstitious nonsens. 
Of course one can manipulate energy fields.
Stick a few trodes on your heads of the neuros and go wild-firing or
calm, and you'll see that you can send to the outside. You are just
too dumb to control it.
Your talk is superstitious nonsense.
Of course trained people can alter energy fields, obviously you did
not get some of the most basic principles there are. 

You are just too whimpish and weak with your mind to attain the
necessary control over the chakra- and other points of your body and
brain, and to alter the energies of sectors of your system .
And because you do not have the power nor the interst to learn the for
a few (dozen) years, you claim that no one else is doing it.
You are the one who is delusional.
You believe that just because you are too lazy to do something or are
too dumb, that all of Earth have to be.
And you believe that just cause your mother obviously has not
commmunicated with you as a baby when the axons were cast out with
brainwaves and you lost most connections for that, that all mothers of
Earth do want their babies head-blind.

You are dumb, you do not understand the differences in cultures, the
results of their research, the different ways to educate children, and
then you tell that you know for all of Earth of something is not so
cause YOU can't do it and cause YOU have not yet seen someone do it.

>There is no such thing as reading auras.
Well, reading is an odd term. But if you alter to different energy
levels you catch different frequencies better, and if you sort of look
from those different "angles"/energy-levels at the energies around a
person some can perceive a lot about them.

Maybe one of the next times I go frequency surfing with friends maybe
I ask them if they mind if we target the fields around us, and then
compare the fields of them, and think about the question of "reading",
but I have the suspicion that the few hundred whatevers I can read are
not sufficient, and that I'd have to train into the ranges of several
thousand of the odd frequencies to really start to be able to get some
sort of readout from the aura and to perceive it far better.

But I once saw a weird one:
It was not as dense as they normally are but more spread, and more
foggy, and many of the "sparks seemed to dance slower".
It was of a man who had cancer in the marrow of his bones of the cells
that are like base cells from where the (?)lympathic and (?)myeloic
cells are made. (Sorry, not sure about the English terms nor about
bio)

So I believe some people who can do many thousands of frequencies
maybe really can sort of make a readout by looking at the energies
around a person and if they are trained by their culture then they can
of course also look at the organs and bones and perceive stuff about
illnesses.

If you see them all together you can perceive a lot about a person.
Actually I often believe that they should rather use the mind than
machines to scan a person, and only use the machines if the mind is
not sufficient.
A lot of them machines make frequencies that are far worse than those
of another person running a scanning.

>> Maybe you simply never met a practicer of magick, but if you ever meet

>No, I have not met one. 
That is what I say.

>Nor will I ever because they do not exist.
Again the old delusion that just cause YOU have not met someone they
do not exist.
I am sure you have gone into the high cultures for magick (India,
northern Peru, Australia, ...) and spent a few years in each going to
the greatest magicians they have and are positive on your judgement.


>There are merely people who claim it, like yourself who can do nothing.

Did I ever say that I am a magician?!
I mean, I like to go frequency surfing with someone, but that's about
it.
And I somehow don't foresee myself spending hours every day to get
central control over the charkra points and other centers & their
energy levels & practicing altering and extending fields forever and a
day.
There is stuff that is more fun in life than that.

(Though I know people who practice it.)
I said that I do understand a lot of what Carlos Castaneda said.
But if I watch a person balancing over a rope and understand a lot
about the principle involved that does not mean that I will not fall
from the rope after one or a few steps, when lucky maybe making a few
meters.
I might understand the principle of a long balancing-stick without
ever having used one,
and if someone tells me that no one can go over a rope I might be dumb
enough to start a discussion on the net with him trying to get his
dumb mind to realize that just cause he can't do it it does not mean
that no one on the whole planet can't.

But I guess if he then insists that he has never seen anyone going
over a rope and that therefore such a thing never has existed and
never will exist, the discussion is a bit too dumb to continue.





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