"r norman" <rsn_ at _comcast.net> wrote in message
news:7j4351t2j49m20mn6uan90523g0b4cnfk6 at 4ax.com...
> On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 14:55:31 -0400, "Glen M. Sizemore"
> <gmsizemore2 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >There is, however, a larger issue here in that terms like
> >"awareness," etc. raise sticky conceptual issues. If Shiavo would have
> >reflexive movements to [what most of us would call] "painful stimuli"
> >we say that she is aware of pain? Most would say "no," but reflexes (not
> >simple ones though) are often what we examine when we look at "pain" in
> >nonhuman animals. Notice that I am not arguing that Shiavo is "conscious"
> >"aware" but, rather that difficult conceptual issues are raised. My
> >view regarding pain (and my wife and I have written a paper on this
> >is that we use "pain language" when we observe reflexive behavior, escape
> >and avoidance, as well as first-person reports (i.e., we say someone is
> >pain when they tell us they are). We also use "pain language" when we
> >observe pain responses in ourselves. Non-human animals show reflexes and
> >escape and avoidance, but they are not aware of their own pain responses,
> >though they can be made aware in that sense.
>> An excellent point, which is exactly why I used the terms "conscious"
> and "awareness" in talking about responding to stimuli. Isolated
> spinal cords can respond to complex stimuli with complex motor
> patterns that are appropriately directed towards the stimulus and
> different types of stimuli elicit different responses, including those
> closely related to what a conscious human would call pain. The real
> problem is decided when higher brain functions are sufficiently lost
> so that the "person" is essentially dead although the living cells in
> the body still are capable of reacting.
>> I strongly believe that the video and the photos are enormously
> misleading in that they are carefully selected to cause naive
> onlookers to think that there is consciousness or awareness. From the
> news reports I have been able to glean, it seems that trained medical
> examiners who had actually examined her concluded that there was none.
I say a CAT of TS's brain, it was largely gone in the cross section
shown. Gone!! She been dead for 15 years. If I am that
situation, I hope they harvest me for organs though at 56
years they are getting a bit too old.