From glucegen1 at excite.com Wed Feb 1 18:07:43 2006 From: glucegen1 at excite.com (Radium) Date: Wed Feb 1 18:36:04 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! Message-ID: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Why has no one answered this question of mine? Please answer it bara...@comcast.net wrote: > The redness and whiteness during light burns is the result of different > behaviour of the subcutaneous capillaries. No. Redness and PALENESS is the result of the different behavior of capillaries. There is a difference between paleness and whiteness. > Heat induces shock. > > The resident granulocytes (histiocytes residing in the subcutaneous tissue) > degranulate, and among others release histamine that is a potent > vasoconstrictor. It causes the smooth muscle in the capillary to constrict. > Constricted blood vessels reduce the blood flow locally, and the skin looks > pale (white). >This reaction is less visible in the more pigmented skin. Not in my case. I am very dark-skinned [literally as dark as an oreo cookie]. My burn wound appeared white -- foamy white. It was NOT cold, so vasocontriction didn't cause the color change. The wound was unusually hot, extremely irritating and painful and FOAMY WHITE. What caused this whiteness? I know it is NOT vasoconstriction! It seemed like a first-degree burn. The skin texture and moisture content didn't change much. There was NO _swelling_ at all! Is it the coagulation of the epidermal proteins that causes the 'whiteness'? If not, then what causes it????????????????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? I know for a fact that it is ^^^^NOT^^^^ vasoconstriction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know for a fact that it is ^^^^NOT^^^^ ^^dehydration^^!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The plate wasn't NEARLY hot enough to ^^dehydrate^^ my skin AT ALL. Plus the duration of contact wasn't long enough to dehydrate my skin in the burn region. I hope my response didn't seem harsh. I was just trying to clarify that the WHITENESS I am describing has nothing to do with VASOCONSTRICTION. Unlike what you describe, the WHITENESS did NOT turn red at all. The wound began to darken to my normal skin color after it healed. I hope you understand. > Now if the burn is more severe, is causes tissue damage. Cells necrotize and > the permeability of endothelial lining of the blood vessels increases > (serum exudes) in addition to the histamines other components are released > too including the components of the complement system, all of this results > in a localized, but rapidly escalating inflammatory reaction. This further > increases the vascular permeability, vasodilation and enhanced blood which > is necessary for leucocytes to infiltrate the damaged tissue (to protect and > help to repair it). > > At this stage erythema formation is common occurrence which is the swelling > and redness of the affected areas of the skin. This takes some time to > develop, so the proper order of changes is: whiteness immediately after the > injury, followed by redness in minutes or hours. > > Now if you have a VERY strong burn, "cauterizing" burn, that coagulates > proteins even deeper in the tissue, it plugs the blood vessels by causing > the proteins to coagulate, there is no blood circulation, and the skin > remains pale (white). Because of reduced circulation, it takes much longer > for the inflammatory reaction to begin and usually the injury develops a > decently sized "sack" filled with yellowish plasma that hides any color > below it (plain optical phenomenon) it protects the underlying tissue but > dries up gradually and normal blood coagulation proteins help to form a > brownish cover over the damaged area. > > The ultimate burn injury results in charring. Charred tissue is initially a > dry mixture of skin proteins and blood, contains large amount of > carbohydrates, lipids, hemoglobins etc, and all kind of degradation products > thereof, carbonized, caramelized sugars etc, that causes it to have a dark > almost black color. It never regenerates (dead tissue), but easily breaks > and allows bacteria to seep into the wounds. charred tissue is usually > removed to hasten the healing. > > lajos Hmm, I wonder what would happen if all the proteins in my epidermal tissues throughout my body were thermally-denatured completely but did NOT form *covalent* bonds after being denatured. Please note: My email address is not glucegen1@excite.com. I don't use that address. I use glucegen1b@excite.com From nichevo at gmail.com Wed Feb 1 18:29:01 2006 From: nichevo at gmail.com (Nichevo) Date: Wed Feb 1 18:46:04 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> This has been reposted more than enough already, do it again and post photo evidence or fuck off. From glucegen1 at excite.com Wed Feb 1 18:44:05 2006 From: glucegen1 at excite.com (Radium) Date: Wed Feb 1 19:06:03 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Nichevo wrote: > This has been reposted more than enough already, do it again and post > photo evidence or fuck off. Well, no one gave me any rational answer. Some told me it was vasoconstriction. Others said it was dehydration. I know it was neither vasoconstriction or dehydration. However, I *still* don't know exactly what caused the thermal burn to look white. From tressure at gmail.com Wed Feb 1 19:07:52 2006 From: tressure at gmail.com (tressure@gmail.com) Date: Wed Feb 1 19:26:03 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> > Well, no one gave me any rational answer. This would be conclusive evidence of one of two things: a) Nobody here knows. b) Nobody here cares. Either way, continuing to ask the same question again and again is unlikely to generate new and interesting responses. From nichevo at gmail.com Wed Feb 1 19:12:36 2006 From: nichevo at gmail.com (Nichevo) Date: Wed Feb 1 19:36:05 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138839156.524029.238720@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> As you are obviously pretty new I will go easy on you: Welcome to usenet! Drop it already. From glucegen1 at excite.com Wed Feb 1 19:43:00 2006 From: glucegen1 at excite.com (Radium) Date: Wed Feb 1 19:56:05 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> tressure@gmail.com wrote: > > Well, no one gave me any rational answer. > > This would be conclusive evidence of one of two things: > > a) Nobody here knows. > b) Nobody here cares. WTF?! I posted it to biology, medical, and chemistry newsgroups! They should know and care, because my question involves biological, medical, and chemical entities! > Either way, continuing to ask the same question again and again is > unlikely to generate new and interesting responses. From Realspace at comcast.not Wed Feb 1 20:08:44 2006 From: Realspace at comcast.not (Spaceman) Date: Wed Feb 1 20:26:05 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: "Radium" wrote in message news:1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... | tressure@gmail.com wrote: | WTF?! I posted it to biology, medical, and chemistry newsgroups! They | should know and care, because my question involves biological, medical, | and chemical entities! Did you ever post how you burned it? Was it some caustic soda? :) From glucegen1 at excite.com Wed Feb 1 20:22:18 2006 From: glucegen1 at excite.com (Radium) Date: Wed Feb 1 20:36:04 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138843338.376379.41260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Spaceman wrote: > "Radium" wrote in message > news:1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... > | tressure@gmail.com wrote: > | WTF?! I posted it to biology, medical, and chemistry newsgroups! They > | should know and care, because my question involves biological, medical, > | and chemical entities! > > Did you ever post how you burned it? > Was it some caustic soda? > :) No. I've said repeatedly, the burn was caused by contact with a hot plate. From tressure at gmail.com Thu Feb 2 13:24:27 2006 From: tressure at gmail.com (tressure@gmail.com) Date: Thu Feb 2 13:46:04 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138904667.832785.47380@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> > WTF?! I posted it to biology, medical, and chemistry newsgroups! They > should know and care, because my question involves biological, medical, > and chemical entities! Sorry-my mistake. I forgot that you would be a much better judge than I of what I am interested in. The fact that you haven't got the answer you wanted after umpteen thousand repititions of the question must be an experimental error, and not an indication that nobody cares. So go ahead- ask the question again, and again, until you get the answer you want. What's that definition of insanity again? Doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results? From david.bostwick at chemistry.gatech.edu Thu Feb 2 13:40:15 2006 From: david.bostwick at chemistry.gatech.edu (David Bostwick) Date: Thu Feb 2 14:06:02 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> <1138904667.832785.47380@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: In article <1138904667.832785.47380@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, tressure@gmail.com wrote: >> WTF?! I posted it to biology, medical, and chemistry newsgroups! They >> should know and care, because my question involves biological, medical, >> and chemical entities! > >Sorry-my mistake. I forgot that you would be a much better judge than >I of what I am interested in. The fact that you haven't got the answer >you wanted after umpteen thousand repititions of the question must be >an experimental error, and not an indication that nobody cares. > >So go ahead- ask the question again, and again, until you get the >answer you want. > >What's that definition of insanity again? Doing the same thing over >and over, and expecting different results? > Call your doctor. You can pay him or her to give you an answer. From tressure at gmail.com Thu Feb 2 13:52:09 2006 From: tressure at gmail.com (tressure@gmail.com) Date: Thu Feb 2 14:16:05 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! In-Reply-To: References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> <1138904667.832785.47380@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: <1138906329.924496.122480@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> > >What's that definition of insanity again? Doing the same thing over > >and over, and expecting different results? > Call your doctor. You can pay him or her to give you an answer. If that reply was directed at me, should I point out that the question was rhetorical? From david.bostwick at chemistry.gatech.edu Thu Feb 2 15:16:27 2006 From: david.bostwick at chemistry.gatech.edu (David Bostwick) Date: Thu Feb 2 15:36:04 2006 Subject: [Cytonet] Re: Why was the FIRST-degree burn ^^^^FOAMY WHITE^^^^?!?! Was It Coagulation??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Please Answer With Reasonable Responses!!!! Its NOT VASOCONSTRICTION or DEHYDRATION!!!!!!!!!! References: <1138835263.581497.236290@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138836541.399285.315600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138837445.532217.138700@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138838872.784815.97180@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1138840980.823758.232290@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> <1138904667.832785.47380@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> <1138906329.924496.122480@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: In article <1138906329.924496.122480@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, tressure@gmail.com wrote: >> >What's that definition of insanity again? Doing the same thing over >> >and over, and expecting different results? >> Call your doctor. You can pay him or her to give you an answer. > >If that reply was directed at me, should I point out that the question >was rhetorical? > Sorry. The suggestion was for the OP.