In article <3rkbnv$rn9 at oac4.hsc.uth.tmc.edu>,
bryan fisk <bryan_fisk at gyn.mda.uth.tmc.edu> wrote:
>> then to dr fuchs question again
>>>>Just because I cannot think of any way that the immune system can
>>>distinguish between idiotypes and foreign antigens does not mean that
>>>there is no such mechanism. Therefore I repeat, can anyone provide me
>>>with an acceptable answer to this question?
>>> the tcells that are reactive to those identicle epitopes or
>>idiotopes are deleted in the thymus. these tcells dont reach the
>>perhiphery to react with a b cell.
>>I thought T-cells were educated in the thymus upon thymic epithelium and
>not B-cells? Also, since each T- and B-cell has a clonotypic, rearranged
>receptor, from which idiotopes may arise, wouldn't each T-cell have to
>be tolerized against each B-cell idiotope? I don't see how that could be
>possible.
>>Yes, and this is exactly why the concept of "self" "non-self" discrimination
as a hypothesis to explain immune responses is flawed. Hence the need
to add in another alternative or extra level of discrimination before an
immune response is activated. eg the "danger" "no danger" ideas of Polly
Matzinger and Ephraim Fuchs. (For immune response read adaptive immune reponse).
Mike Clark, mrc7 at cam.ac.ukhttp://www.path.cam.ac.uk/MikeClark/
--
o/ \\ // || ,_ o Dr. M.R. Clark, Division of Immunology
<\__,\\ // __o || / /\, Cambridge University, Dept. Pathology
"> || _`\<,_ // \\ \> | Tennis Court Rd., Cambridge CB2 1QP
` || (_)/ (_) // \\ \_ Tel. 01223 333705 Fax. 01223 333875
